5131R garantee paper

[pp5575]

I am informed by my AD about my 5131R garantee paper. "Under new policy, Patek Philippe retain the original guarantee for 5131 reference for two years, I will send you a copy when I receive it."


This is a first time that I can't has my paper right away with the purchase watch.


Do you like this PP new policy?

[scarlet knight]

Not how it worked for me last month in the USA. I would check on this.

[pp5575]

Two year means to me could be short or long time. Anything could happen to you. What happen if you are not be able to collect the paper after two year for any reason?

I pay the money. Why I can't collect what suppose belong to me?

Will it causes me any trobule if I have to send my watch to the service center?

I know it may not be a big deal for someone, but I just don't like this idea.

I am getting quite upset. I have to wait for new purchasing watch and maintenance watch. Now I have to wait for two years for my garantee paper.

[KarlS]

It's a U.K. policy on certain models. Russell had the same on his. It's to stop flipping. If you have no plans to flip it doesn't really matter who has the papers. If a 5131P was offered to me tomorrow I would probably be ok with 5 years!!!

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by scarlet knight

Not how it worked for me last month in the USA. I would check on this.

Applies to 5131 in UK, i don't think HSWA particularly cares as long as it equals sales!

[Marciano490]

Originally Posted by pp5575

Two year means to me could be short or long time. Anything could happen to you. What happen if you are not be able to collect the paper after two year for any reason?

I pay the money. Why I can't collect what suppose belong to me?

Will it causes me any trobule if I have to send my watch to the service center?

I know it may not be a big deal for someone, but I just don't like this idea.

I am getting quite upset. I have to wait for new purchasing watch and maintenance watch. Now I have to wait for two years for my garantee paper.

I don't like this policy. I understand the desire to fight flippers but it treats Patek's best customers like untrustworthy children. I love the watch, but you have every right to be insulted my friend.

[pp5575]

Originally Posted by Marciano490

I don't like this policy. I understand the desire to fight flippers but it treats Patek's best customers like untrustworthy children. I love the watch, but you have every right to be insulted my friend.

That is what I feel "insult".

I do not know what other 5131 owner feel, But I real do not like the policy. It makes me to buy less PP in the future.

[KarlS]

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthre...ighlight=Rhone

Just buy anywhere else in the world except UK ....no problem!!!

[Marciano490]

Originally Posted by KarlS

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthre...ighlight=Rhone

Just buy anywhere else in the world except UK ....no problem!!!

Easy enough to pop in anywhere and grab a 5131!

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by Marciano490

Easy enough to pop in anywhere and grab a 5131!

About as easy to get anywhere in the world as the UK...if you don't like the policy take your money elsewhere...not a big issue!!

[Marciano490]

Originally Posted by KarlS

About as easy to get anywhere in the world as the UK...if you don't like the policy take your money elsewhere...not a big issue!!

I think the issue is for people who have been on a list for years in the U.K. and are now being told to deal with it. Plus, as you know, you need a preexisting relationship with an AD. I'm not sure why you're downplaying it.

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by Marciano490

I think the issue is for people who have been on a list for years in the U.K. and are now being told to deal with it. Plus, as you know, you need a preexisting relationship with an AD. I'm not sure why you're downplaying it.

Because I agree with it possibly??

If it means genuine collectors get it versus those looking to make a quick buck I am all in!!!

if it means economic flippers are deterred I wish they introduce this globally! The premium is just too big!

[Marciano490]

Originally Posted by KarlS

Because I agree with it possibly??

If it means genuine collectors get it versus those looking to make a quick buck I am all in!!!

if it means economic flippers are deterred I wish they introduce this globally! The premium is just too big!

You're making the same assumption Patek is. Guilty till proven innocent. Flipping is a problem, but accusing your best customer preemptively as looking to flip is a horrible idea.

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by Marciano490

You're making the same assumption Patek is. Guilty till proven innocent. Flipping is a problem, but accusing your best customer preemptively as looking to flip is a horrible idea.

Let's presume every 5131 is allocated to a "best customer"....considering the number of sealed 5131's on the grey market...surely these "best customers" are guilty of economic flipping. They are sealed!!! As for 5575 I think his collection and relationship with PP is undoubted!! However to make an exception for a single individual would be contrary to English sensibilities!!

[Jetkopite]

I dont think its a bad thing, if I had the chance to get the 5131R at retail from the AD and they kept my papers for 2 years that would be cool on a piece like that with such demand. Instead I had to pay crazy premium to own a watch like that all because so called collectors who get these pieces end up keeping them sealed in a safe in HK until they can flip them at nearly double the price they bought it for.

I wrote a huge letter to Mr Stern with regards to this policy last year and how much I disagreed with it as genuine lovers of this watch dont have a chance of ever owning one.I also told him my story and how I paid silly money on top of retail.

By the way PP5575 I am in no way assuming you are buying to flip, if are gonna keep it and enjoy it just get it get the AD to give you a copy of the original papers. Dont think there would be any issues either with sending in the watch for repair as I am sure they will register the watch in your name in the system..

As I said I would have no issues getting a 5131R/5131P at retail and them keeping papers.

Look forward to the incoming PP5575 :-))

[KarlS]

If we used chrono24 as an admittedly flawed population and filtered watches down to "available now" there are around 60 available for sale. Rumour has it that they make 40 a year (I don't know!) so we have 18 months production in the grey market! Roughly 50% from USA which is one of the smaller PP markets (according to last available public information) and 3 from the U.K. No surprise a large amount from China / Hong Kong where you will sometimes see at least 2 sealed in a grey dealers window. I think once the moral indignation is out the way those that have a genuine desire to hold medium term would really embrace thus attempt to control fLippers even at the expense of annoying those very customers you want to preserve.

As an economic bottom feeder I have to take whatever crumbs are offered to me...if I don't like it lots of brands I can switch over to

[unknown]

Originally Posted by KarlS

If we used chrono24 as an admittedly flawed population and filtered watches down to "available now" there are around 60 available for sale. Rumour has it that they make 40 a year (I don't know!) so we have 18 months production in the grey market! Roughly 50% from USA which is one of the smaller PP markets (according to last available public information) and 3 from the U.K. No surprise a large amount from China / Hong Kong where you will sometimes see at least 2 sealed in a grey dealers window. I think once the moral indignation is out the way those that have a genuine desire to hold medium term would really embrace thus attempt to control fLippers even at the expense of annoying those very customers you want to preserve.

As an economic bottom feeder I have to take whatever crumbs are offered to me...if I don't like it lots of brands I can switch over to

don't know the number karl but I sure it is A LOT more than 40 per year

[Jetkopite]

Originally Posted by unknown

don't know the number karl but I sure it is A LOT more than 40 per year

I believe its between 30-50 a year tops from various sources..

[unknown]

Originally Posted by Jetkopite

I believe its between 30-50 a year tops from various sources..

Andy, Karl,

There are about 400 Patek AD in the world
With your estimation this would mean every AD gets one every 10 years
I hope you agree this is wrong
Most AD I know get one every 2 till 4 years. The really big dealers get one every year
Let's say an average of 1 every 3 years for an average dealer ?

That's more like 150 per year, and I'm pretty comfortable with that number. It's definitely closer to 150 than 40

[Jetkopite]

Originally Posted by unknown

Andy, Karl,

There are about 400 Patek AD in the world
With your estimation this would mean every AD gets one every 10 years
I hope you agree this is wrong
Most AD I know get one every 2 till 4 years. The really big dealers get one every year
Let's say an average of 1 every 3 years for an average dealer ?

That's more like 150 per year, and I'm pretty comfortable with that number. It's definitely closer to 150 than 40

I dont agree my friend because every one of the 400 ADs you mention will not get an allocation. I have friends at London, Geneva and NY salons and they will be lucky if they have seen 2-3 a year each since production started. Here in Dubai they have seen maybe 2 pieces tops. I cant see how you come up with 150 a year. My friend when I asked in Geneva salon which is the mothership wouldnt tell me exact numbers but he stressed that the numbers were very very low.

The guy here at the Patek AD in Dubai told me when they went to do their training in Geneva for Patek the guys asked about number of 5131Rs they make and was told 20-30 pieces which I cant believe eventhough that's from Patek itself.

[RussW]

Originally Posted by KarlS

Let's presume every 5131 is allocated to a "best customer"....considering the number of sealed 5131's on the grey market...surely these "best customers" are guilty of economic flipping. They are sealed!!! As for 5575 I think his collection and relationship with PP is undoubted!! However to make an exception for a single individual would be contrary to English sensibilities!!

I agree. There is no need to feel insulted, as it is not a policy against a particular individual, but a blanket policy. There are a lot of 5131s on the secondary market, and Patek are trying to tackle that.

I can understand it's frustrating for genuine customers such as Brian but I believe it's for the greater good.

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by unknown

Andy, Karl,

There are about 400 Patek AD in the world
With your estimation this would mean every AD gets one every 10 years
I hope you agree this is wrong
Most AD I know get one every 2 till 4 years. The really big dealers get one every year
Let's say an average of 1 every 3 years for an average dealer ?

That's more like 150 per year, and I'm pretty comfortable with that number. It's definitely closer to 150 than 40

My AD has seen I believe 2 since launch. Actually in my thread (I embedded) this was actually covered when I suggested there were more 5131's than 5575's and we had a lot of input. Cheers

[lapince]

I must say if I get a 5131p I won't mind if they keep it

[Jetkopite]

Originally Posted by KarlS

My AD has seen I believe 2 since launch. Actually in my thread (I embedded) this was actually covered when I suggested there were more 5131's than 5575's and we had a lot of input. Cheers

I think if production of the 5131R goes on for another 2-3 years there will still be less of them than the limited 5575 and 40th Anniversary editions..?

[lapince]

Originally Posted by Jetkopite

I think if production of the 5131R goes on for another 2-3 years there will still be less of them than the limited 5575 and 40th Anniversary editions..?

I think Karl was talking about the different 5131's. Not sure about production but my AD had one when I went to get my 5712, seems some AD's get very little or none

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by Jetkopite

I think if production of the 5131R goes on for another 2-3 years there will still be less of them than the limited 5575 and 40th Anniversary editions..?

And it's closer to half the price!!

[unknown]

Originally Posted by Jetkopite

I dont agree my friend because every one of the 400 ADs you mention will not get an allocation. I have friends at London, Geneva and NY salons and they will be lucky if they have seen 2-3 a year each since production started. Here in Dubai they have seen maybe 2 pieces tops. I cant see how you come up with 150 a year. My friend when I asked in Geneva salon which is the mothership wouldnt tell me exact numbers but he stressed that the numbers were very very low.

The guy here at the Patek AD in Dubai told me when they went to do their training in Geneva for Patek the guys asked about number of 5131Rs they make and was told 20-30 pieces which I cant believe eventhough that's from Patek itself.

I'm sure the 5131R is even a lot more
When the made the G and J they have to divide the enamel dials
The case an movement is widely available, the difficulty is of course the enamel dial
But since the R is the only one in production, that can all focus on one dial instead of 2 dials
Don't shoot me but if you allow me to guess ... I would say that make at least 150 R per year

My guess is that they will have made about 500 in each color, and probably they will make about 150 one day in platinum ( only 1 year production)

An even more sought after watch is the 5070 P
They made probably between 125 and 175 of these. Look at chrono 24 Only 10 of these are available
Now search for the 5131, 76 are available

When 76 5131 are available, you can be sure they make a lot more than 40 per year

This is a good forum but if you want to reach more serieus or more diehard patek fans you might want to post such a thread on www.watchprosite.com.
Ask their opinion .... and let's see if it is closer to 40 or to 150 per year

[Jetkopite]

Originally Posted by lapince

I think Karl was talking about the different 5131's. Not sure about production but my AD had one when I went to get my 5712, seems some AD's get very little or none

I agree most ADs wont even see one and the biggest ADs might see 2 a year at best from my experience talking to Boutiques and ADs around the World.

[Jetkopite]

Originally Posted by unknown

I'm sure the 5131R is even a lot more
When the made the G and J they have to divide the enamel dials
The case an movement is widely available, the difficulty is of course the enamel dial
But since the R is the only one in production, that can all focus on one dial instead of 2 dials
Don't shoot me but if you allow me to guess ... I would say that make at least 150 R per year

My guess is that they will have made about 500 in each color, and probably they will make about 150 one day in platinum ( only 1 year production)

An even more sought after watch is the 5070 P
They made probably between 125 and 175 of these. Look at chrono 24 Only 10 of these are available
Now search for the 5131, 76 are available

When 76 5131 are available, you can be sure they make a lot more than 40 per year

This is a good forum but if you want to reach more serieus or more diehard patek fans you might want to post such a thread on www.watchprosite.com.
Ask their opinion .... and let's see if it is closer to 40 or to 150 per year

Even if 76 5131Rs are available on chrono24 as you say I dont think that is true as maybe a third or even half dont even have the watch in their possession. If you want to base your estimate on chrono24 numbers its upto you. Im going on what I hear from Salons, boutiques and ADs..

[unknown]

Originally Posted by Jetkopite

I think if production of the 5131R goes on for another 2-3 years there will still be less of them than the limited 5575 and 40th Anniversary editions..?

I think the R will be discontinued at Basel 2018 year

And follow the same route as the legendary 5070

10 years in production .... and the 10th year a platinum case that will be available only 1 year

so my guess is that at basel 2018 they will announce the P and it will be discontinued the year after

I keep my more or less 150 pieces per year estimation so there will be 150 platinum 5131