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Old 1 April 2020, 03:53 PM   #91
cerendigit
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Nice work.

Some if these watches were going down way before the covid19. The 126710blnr (i.e. batgirl) is one of them.
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Old 1 April 2020, 04:03 PM   #92
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[QUOTE]There is no such thing as either, dude. Nicknames are just that./QUOTE]

Rolex would disagree with you.
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Old 1 April 2020, 04:30 PM   #93
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Thank you OP. Seems the real bloodletting will be with other brands.
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Old 1 April 2020, 04:36 PM   #94
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From what I've read, I think 2016/17 watches will be at a bargain since the 5 year warranties will be up.
Warranties don't affect the pricing. Where did you read this?

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Old 1 April 2020, 05:16 PM   #95
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[QUOTE=Jamhot;10500973]
Quote:
There is no such thing as either, dude. Nicknames are just that./QUOTE]

Rolex would disagree with you.
Oh God... Rolex would disagree with me??

Yeah, I care. Along with the larger world.
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Old 1 April 2020, 05:25 PM   #96
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The Rolex fanbois are hilarious. The term Batgirl causes people to triple check their bifocals around here. And actually cause arguments! Batman, Batgirl, they're both silly nicknames for your watch. To take issue with either is to truly be someone that everyone else loves to laugh at. Funny as hell, you Batgirl whiners.
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Old 1 April 2020, 05:33 PM   #97
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I'm waiting for them to go below MSRP.
Good luck with that one
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Old 1 April 2020, 05:59 PM   #98
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Good luck with that one
I'm not paying more for a used second hand item. Sod that! Have you seen how many there are?
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Old 1 April 2020, 06:13 PM   #99
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Not sure what grey dealer you deal with but both of my Rolex were from grey's and both were NIB unworn and full set ad one with my name on the card. There's are very trusted grey dealers that don't sell you second, third, fourth ect.. Can't bad mouth all for the fault of one...
If you buy directly from a Rolex AD you have a new watch. If you buy from a grey dealer you have, at best, a second hand watch. It doesn’t matter what condition it is in, someone else has owned it since it left the AD.
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Old 1 April 2020, 06:15 PM   #100
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If you buy directly from a Rolex AD you have a new watch. If you buy from a grey dealer you have, at best, a second hand watch. It doesn’t matter what condition it is in, someone else has owned it since it left the AD.
I also love the ads that say "brand new never worn" yet includes wristshots out in the garden and around the house :)
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Old 1 April 2020, 06:19 PM   #101
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I also love the ads that say "brand new never worn" yet includes wristshots out in the garden and around the house :)
Not so much with greys, but more private sellers.......my favorite is when it goes something like ‘Condition- Scratches across case, knick on the bezel and some desk diving marks all across bracelet. I would say it’s MINT!’

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Old 1 April 2020, 06:24 PM   #102
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If you buy directly from a Rolex AD you have a new watch. If you buy from a grey dealer you have, at best, a second hand watch. It doesn’t matter what condition it is in, someone else has owned it since it left the AD.
Not the ones where ADs sell back door straight to dealers. There’s no difference between those and what you get from an AD
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Old 1 April 2020, 06:29 PM   #103
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I also love the ads that say "brand new never worn" yet includes wristshots out in the garden and around the house :)
As far as I’m concerned, the only watches which have never been worn are those still in the original Rolex packaging as they are delivered to the AD.

I’m surprised how many people on here post photos and comments about how they have, and been allowed to by ADs, try on a watch which is already sold to someone else.

I suspect that there are very few watches which can truthfully be described as “Never worn” after they have arrived at an AD’s.
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Old 1 April 2020, 06:35 PM   #104
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I must be one of the few who really don’t care whether a watch has dropped by 0.1% since covid 19
Then why open the thread? No one made you read it.
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Old 1 April 2020, 06:51 PM   #105
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Not the ones where ADs sell back door straight to dealers. There’s no difference between those and what you get from an AD

Surely you have just proved my point!

The AD sells them to the dealer who then sells them to their customer.

The customer then buys a watch previously owned by the dealer therefore they are buying a second hand watch. If the customer had bought direct from the AD, the manufacturer’s approved distributor, they are buying new, they are the “first hand” to own the watch after the officially approved distributor. If the AD sells to a dealer, the dealer is the first hand, the person who then buys from the dealer is the second hand.

First or second hand has nothing to do with the physical condition of an item, the terms relate to the number of previous owners the item has had since it left the manufacturer’s official sales dept or distributor.

You could buy an “as new” watch from a dealer, but it is still second hand.

If it was new how much did you pay for it? If it was new you would have paid the manufacturer’s retail price from an AD. If you have paid more than the manufacturer’s retail price where has the difference in price gone to? It’s gone to the dealer who owned it after the AD and before you. The difference you paid went to the first owner who chose to sell their item on for a profit to another who bought the item “used” or second hand. The first owner “used” their watch to make a profit even if they did not wear it.
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Old 1 April 2020, 08:35 PM   #106
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Surely you have just proved my point!

The AD sells them to the dealer who then sells them to their customer.

The customer then buys a watch previously owned by the dealer therefore they are buying a second hand watch. If the customer had bought direct from the AD, the manufacturer’s approved distributor, they are buying new, they are the “first hand” to own the watch after the officially approved distributor. If the AD sells to a dealer, the dealer is the first hand, the person who then buys from the dealer is the second hand.

First or second hand has nothing to do with the physical condition of an item, the terms relate to the number of previous owners the item has had since it left the manufacturer’s official sales dept or distributor.

You could buy an “as new” watch from a dealer, but it is still second hand.

If it was new how much did you pay for it? If it was new you would have paid the manufacturer’s retail price from an AD. If you have paid more than the manufacturer’s retail price where has the difference in price gone to? It’s gone to the dealer who owned it after the AD and before you. The difference you paid went to the first owner who chose to sell their item on for a profit to another who bought the item “used” or second hand. The first owner “used” their watch to make a profit even if they did not wear it.
Glad that's cleared up
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Old 1 April 2020, 08:53 PM   #107
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Hopefully.
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Old 1 April 2020, 10:15 PM   #108
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I'm not paying more for a used second hand item. Sod that! Have you seen how many there are?

Tons of second hand watches on the market. It’s not like they were produced in limited quantities. Imagine being the guy who paid double msrp for a used watch these last 2 years. I’d be sick to my stomach watching this. I’d probably actually sell right now to recoup some of my loss and then reacquire down the road at less than msrp
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Old 1 April 2020, 10:16 PM   #109
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Wanted to share this interesting table below. I have been tracking online prices daily for the past week for some of the toughest to get pieces .

The prices highlighted in green show days that the price for a certain watch came down. You can definitely see a trend going down although a one week time frame is too short to see if it will persist and/or if price reductions will start to be more substantial.

Attachment 1123688
This is great, thanks for posting! Still waiting for the batgirl to come down to about 11500 and then I'd gladly purchase
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Old 1 April 2020, 10:38 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by Hollie_Rollie View Post
Tons of second hand watches on the market. It’s not like they were produced in limited quantities. Imagine being the guy who paid double msrp for a used watch these last 2 years. I’d be sick to my stomach watching this. I’d probably actually sell right now to recoup some of my loss and then reacquire down the road at less than msrp
Queue the 2x MSRP brigade who will swear up and down this will never happen and you’re dreaming
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Old 1 April 2020, 10:41 PM   #111
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I'm not paying more for a used second hand item. Sod that! Have you seen how many there are?
Yep, of course. Greys have loads of them.
If you’re after a date just, then maybe under list.

However if you’re expecting a ceramic GMT Pepsi, batgirl, LV, Daytona etc to sell under list, you’ll have a LONG wait in my opinion
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Old 1 April 2020, 10:48 PM   #112
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Interesting information and based on the data and methodology used by the OP some interesting facts and trends can be seen. The time horizon is the factor that will allow us to see how this progresses and if we are seeing true trends or if we are seeing an anomaly created by the current world conditions. I believe we will see a dip in prices, not supper significant, when comparing asking and getting prices. Several of the factors we will not ever have is how much the Grey Sellers have in a watch and what is the amount they will take. If a Trusted Seller lists a hot SS Daytona for 22k and will only take a slight reduction in selling price and had previously listed the watch for 24K and would take $1500-2000 off we are close to the same place price wise. I also believe that many of the larger sellers will be buying everything they can get. When we begin to lift out of the current situation availability will be more limited from AD's as many have sold held back inventory. Rolex will have limited supply as production shutdowns will take a toll on the number of watches available and prices will blow up. If you think the whining is bad now about price and availability wait till we lift out. I will follow this thread and I look forward to new data and the comments of my fellow TRF members.
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Old 1 April 2020, 10:53 PM   #113
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Queue the 2x MSRP brigade who will swear up and down this will never happen and you’re dreaming



Comment after yours was the best. Perfect timing
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Old 1 April 2020, 10:54 PM   #114
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I’m finding out exactly how much many of my friends had saved in the bank.....because they’re talking about how they barely have enough to make NYC rent this month and if something doesn’t change, they’re screwed come May 1. These are definitely not min wage people either, they own nice things. I don’t even want to think about normal Joe with a family who just lost his job. That’s terrifying.

It truly bamboozles me that so many people are naive to the fact of how the majority of Americans essentially live paycheck to paycheck. Most people change their spending habits/lifestyle dependent on their income, so a higher income doesn’t actually result in more money saved. Everything is not just going to be ‘okay’ and we rise out of this as if nothing happened. If a vaccine was released in two weeks there’s already MAJOR damage done. There’s a domino effect in progress with this health crisis creating an unemployment crisis and there’s about to be a housing crisis.

But everybody keep believing what they want to believe. I’m pretty sure with every downturn you have naysayers until the last minute.
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Old 1 April 2020, 11:03 PM   #115
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Way too broad a generalisation to be even close to true.

There are number of people I know in the 35-55 age range, who don't have Instagram, don't follow watch trends, aren't collectors, etc, but know of Rolex's quality and brand appeal. Do you know how surprising it is when they walk in to an AD, after checking out the watches on the Rolex website, and being told there's a two year wait on a Sub?

It's not about price - it's about availability. If you want to pay double for a watch, go for it - your money. But all I see coming from the current situation is that I - and many like me - will maybe, and it's still a big maybe, be able to walk into an AD and get the watch we want at the MSRP set by Rolex. And I, like many others, won't care what it is worth the moment we leave the store.
I do understand what you mean. I know 1 guy like that at work. Had been looking at the Rolex website for a year, going into the store in the duty free in the airport every time expecting to see a GMT, and never seeing one. I told him check a website called chrono24 and that might explain why you’re not finding any, or rather, the used price is self explanatory

I thought he was a rare bird, as he is let’s say a not very inquisitive person.

The people posting here wishing for MSRP are not him, or the people you described. The ‘wish the market would crash’ types are here for the hype and are jealous daydreamers

I’ve never bought anything for more than MSRP either btw, I’ve never been that desperate for a watch.

But ofcourse you’d care what it’s worth when you leave the store. the brand depends on it. You wouldn’t care if your (say) $5000 steel ladies datejust is worth $50 the moment you left the store?
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Old 1 April 2020, 11:08 PM   #116
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I do understand what you mean. I know 1 guy like that at work. Had been looking at the Rolex website for a year, going into the store in the duty free in the airport every time expecting to see a GMT, and never seeing one. I told him check a website called chrono24 and that might explain why you’re not finding any, or rather, the used price is self explanatory

I thought he was a rare bird, as he is let’s say a not very inquisitive person.

The people posting here wishing for MSRP are not him, or the people you described. The ‘wish the market would crash’ types are here for the hype and are jealous daydreamers

I’ve never bought anything for more than MSRP either btw, I’ve never been that desperate for a watch.

But ofcourse you’d care what it’s worth when you leave the store. the brand depends on it. You wouldn’t care if your (say) $5000 steel ladies datejust is worth $50 the moment you left the store?


So if you want the market to return to normal (as in if a watch has a MSRP, that’s what it sells at), where it was for 50+ years up until this small blip since around 2016/17, it means you’re a jealous daydreamer?
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Old 1 April 2020, 11:11 PM   #117
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The Rolex fanbois are hilarious. The term Batgirl causes people to triple check their bifocals around here. And actually cause arguments! Batman, Batgirl, they're both silly nicknames for your watch. To take issue with either is to truly be someone that everyone else loves to laugh at. Funny as hell, you Batgirl whiners.
You certainly seem just as passionate about the subject and easily toss around insults. Why not just drop the subject or are you attempting to troll? As to "Rolex fanbois", you do realize you are posting on ... The Rolex Forums, right?
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Old 1 April 2020, 11:15 PM   #118
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I’m finding out exactly how much many of my friends had saved in the bank.....because they’re talking about how they barely have enough to make NYC rent this month and if something doesn’t change, they’re screwed come May 1. These are definitely not min wage people either, they own nice things. I don’t even want to think about normal Joe with a family who just lost his job. That’s terrifying.

It truly bamboozles me that so many people are naive to the fact of how the majority of Americans essentially live paycheck to paycheck. Most people change their spending habits/lifestyle dependent on their income, so a higher income doesn’t actually result in more money saved. Everything is not just going to be ‘okay’ and we rise out of this as if nothing happened. If a vaccine was released in two weeks there’s already MAJOR damage done. There’s a domino effect in progress with this health crisis creating an unemployment crisis and there’s about to be a housing crisis.

But everybody keep believing what they want to believe. I’m pretty sure with every downturn you have naysayers until the last minute.
You are absolutely right with everything you just wrote. I agree with you 100%.

I think I have a partial answer. The people that have the attitude you’re talking about are probably people living in a gated community feeling secure and have a very nice nest egg and retirement. I swear these people have no idea of the tsunami storm that’s going to be unleashed when millions upon millions of Americans can’t afford the rent or food.
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Old 1 April 2020, 11:17 PM   #119
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So if you want the market to return to normal (as in if a watch has a MSRP, that’s what it sells at), where it was for 50+ years up until this small blip since around 2016/17, it means you’re a jealous daydreamer?
They’re hoping the economy crashes / goes into recession, so that they can acquire a watch at msrp; either 1) so they can feel they join the insta party of wearing a hot watch. Or 2) they can feel smug those that with the piece who may have paid more than MSRP are hurting

Either way, in the event of crash / recession, and the watch returning to MSRP or under, means the watch will no longer be hot, and no one cares, the party is over, so there is no kudos. I.e. 1) is invalid during the said potential crash. And 2) they won’t feel so smug about those who paid over MSRP as the interest no longer exists so that feeling will surely dissipate or not exist In the first place. They probably won’t be posting here any more as all hype will be over. It’ll only be Rolex enthusiast like myself who will stick around, who were buying long before 2016/7 and will continue to afterwards

In either scenario, that kind person (wishing for economic crash person) will not be buying the piece either now or at MSRP in the future (when used prices drop to that level) and is just a daydreamer.
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Old 1 April 2020, 11:23 PM   #120
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You are absolutely right with everything you just wrote. I agree with you 100%.

I think I have a partial answer. The people that have the attitude you’re talking about are probably people living in a gated community feeling secure and have a very nice nest egg and retirement. I swear these people have no idea of the tsunami storm that’s going to be unleashed when millions upon millions of Americans can’t afford the rent or food.
Finally, something we can agree on.


I’m originally from Florida and have tons of friends there who work hospitality as that was my primary source of income throughout high school and undergrad (actually have lived in New Tampa, Channelside, St. Pete and Clearwater beach ). Practically none of them have anything saved and on top of that they have student/credit card debt in addition to normal bills. They’re hurting BAD right now.....
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