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Old 9 November 2020, 12:03 PM   #301
boxster1990
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I agree the prices are elevated but think they will remain so for a few years - for me that basically means I’m not buying my second Journe for several years which has caused me to lose a lot of interest in the brand and research elsewhere since my next watch or 3 will not be a Journe. Maybe it’s also a bit of sour grapes, but if you could’ve paid 50k last year for something and it costs 100k this year - well, that hardly makes you want to dive right in if you have some semblance of financial sense.


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100% agree. So what’s piquing your interest these days?


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Old 9 November 2020, 12:09 PM   #302
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Yeah affordability is one (large) thing and then even if you’re fine with paying 100k for a Journe you do now have to consider a lot of other competition that wasn’t a factor at 50k. This year I started looking at Urwerk and De Bethune, something I never did before, and obviously you’ve now reached deep into Patek and Lange‘a catalogue and are even glancing blows with some RM. I don’t have any of those brands and at that price the personal utility of a first piece from them is probably greater than a second Journe.


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Exactly.

Lange Zeitwerk/Dato
Gronefeld
Kari Voutilainen
MB&F

etc.
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Old 9 November 2020, 12:09 PM   #303
lanteanflux
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100% agree. So what’s piquing your interest these days?


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So interestingly Watchbox had a CB and DB28 Star Wheels listed at the same price (60k USD) which to me was absolute bonkers. I asked them how much I need to top up - if anything - to do that trade. They lowballed me like crazy on the CB (showed me 2019 price for the CB) and I just left it. Bit rude frankly given how much they’re harping on about how it’s an in demand and readily sellable piece. That Star Wheels was bought just last week by some savvy client. Those are the sort of comparisons I’m considering at these Journe prices.


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Old 9 November 2020, 12:16 PM   #304
boxster1990
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Exactly.

Lange Zeitwerk/Dato
Gronefeld
Kari Voutilainen
MB&F

etc.

Do any of those brands make interesting pieces under $50k?


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Old 9 November 2020, 12:20 PM   #305
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Do any of those brands make interesting pieces under $50k?


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Think we mean at the 100k point that Journe resonances etc have reached. Mbf preowned lm 101s are under 50, those were tempting me but too big still


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Old 9 November 2020, 12:35 PM   #306
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Do any of those brands make interesting pieces under $50k?


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If you were looking at used watches around 50k (resonance before hype), then yes..they all do other than Kari. I think his pieces trade around 70k - 80k

A used MB&F LM is like $30k - 40k...
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Old 9 November 2020, 01:05 PM   #307
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If you were looking at used watches around 50k (resonance before hype), then yes..they all do other than Kari. I think his pieces trade around 70k - 80k

A used MB&F LM is like $30k - 40k...

This vanilla 38mm res just went for 350 chf...


https://www.phillips.com/detail/fp-journe/CH080320/257/


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Old 9 November 2020, 10:24 PM   #308
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Do any of those brands make interesting pieces under $50k?


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From Lange, you can find (among other models) the Lange 1, first generation Datograph, 1815 chronograph, 1815 annual calendar, and Langematik Perpetual all pre-owned under $50K. The Lange 1 and 1815 annual calendar also retail below $50K.
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Old 9 November 2020, 11:33 PM   #309
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This vanilla 38mm res just went for 350 chf...


https://www.phillips.com/detail/fp-journe/CH080320/257/


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Are you using “vanilla” to indicate it’s “plainness”? In terms of aesthetics perhaps it is the most vanilla dial, but if you are talking about it being common (numbers produced) then I think you are off the mark on that one.

And you do realize why people are paying a premium for these specific Resonance (regardless of dial material). For as long as I’ve followed Journe these specific watches commanded a decent premium.
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Old 9 November 2020, 11:47 PM   #310
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Are you using “vanilla” to indicate it’s “plainness”? In terms of aesthetics perhaps it is the most vanilla dial, but if you are talking about it being common (numbers produced) then I think you are off the mark on that one.

And you do realize why people are paying a premium for these specific Resonance (regardless of dial material). For as long as I’ve followed Journe these specific watches commanded a decent premium.

Wah didn’t mean to upset you. Vanilla in sense it’s not like the souscription that just came recently, or with similar superstar pedigree. It’s a standard 38mm brass res (not early patinad yellow dial either), and afaik that type of res has never traded remotely close to 350k chf - “a decent premium” indeed. I’m not saying anything against the watch, I’d love a res. And I do know why people have commanded a premium for this res to say a 40mm gold movement, but please share why this particular one is 350k ? Even the high end of the usual lowball estimate was 80k, so if we double that we get to 160k...


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Old 10 November 2020, 06:03 AM   #311
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Wah didn’t mean to upset you. Vanilla in sense it’s not like the souscription that just came recently, or with similar superstar pedigree. It’s a standard 38mm brass res (not early patinad yellow dial either), and afaik that type of res has never traded remotely close to 350k chf - “a decent premium” indeed. I’m not saying anything against the watch, I’d love a res. And I do know why people have commanded a premium for this res to say a 40mm gold movement, but please share why this particular one is 350k ? Even the high end of the usual lowball estimate was 80k, so if we double that we get to 160k...


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You didn’t upset me ! (These are watches, hardly important in the grand scheme of things).

All of these early dials have a similar shimmer or graininess, and some as you say have discolored dials. In the metal they are really attractive and the catalogue pictures did not capture this. The white gold may be less in number that the “signature” yellow or the red, but no one out here really knows.

350k, it’s a bonkers price. No question. 280k, before BP was not so crazy I think and so the seller likely came off OK here even accounting for whatever the SP may have been. From what I’ve seen two of these have sold privately in the last 6 months or so both materially higher than the estimates here but still not near what this one fetched. ACM had one if I’m not mistaken a couple of months ago and the ask was well into the 200’s.

All that said, I’d be much happier paying 380k for this watch than some of the other inflated prices we have seen for Journe pieces.

(Full disclosure: I’m am a biased commentator when it comes to Journe, and when it comes to this watch too so take the above in that context)

The estimates as always are silly,
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Old 23 February 2021, 12:32 AM   #312
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Has the CB peaked? What does everyone think of the 60k + prices?


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Old 23 February 2021, 01:58 AM   #313
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I'm following  the market quite closely, at least for Europe. Most recent sales have been around € 55k vs. € 50k half a year ago. I'm also observing, however, inventory has higher turnaround times at these prices (for CB standards) and you always have 2-3 watches to chose from. I still believe prices will rise further in the long-term, especially if there are rumors coming up of a potential discontinuation.
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Old 23 February 2021, 05:28 AM   #314
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I happened to see this thread again and thought we could use a reminder about how great this watch is. Such a pleasure to wear for just about any occasion, easy on the eyes, and (still) under the radar. My all time favorite!
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Old 23 February 2021, 06:47 AM   #315
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I'm following  the market quite closely, at least for Europe. Most recent sales have been around € 55k vs. € 50k half a year ago. I'm also observing, however, inventory has higher turnaround times at these prices (for CB standards) and you always have 2-3 watches to chose from. I still believe prices will rise further in the long-term, especially if there are rumors coming up of a potential discontinuation.
And why would we hear rumours about Discontinuation ?
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Old 23 February 2021, 07:35 AM   #316
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And why would we hear rumours about Discontinuation ?
Production has gone down and waitlist is closed.
Discontinuation is assured, exact time is unknown but in the near future.
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Old 23 February 2021, 10:47 AM   #317
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Worth the hype. This will be a $100k watch when the time comes. Special rare case material, best blue dial in the game, gorgeous movement, wearable size, limited production, great brand that is now recognized.






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Old 23 February 2021, 12:55 PM   #318
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I just love this one. And I love how it just handles bold, colorful straps so well.

Here is mine from the other day.




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Old 23 February 2021, 05:55 PM   #319
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Production has gone down and waitlist is closed.
Discontinuation is assured, exact time is unknown but in the near future.
Production is reduced because journe wants to make more complicated pieces.
So it went from about 200 per year to 100 ( this since 2019 I believe)
Another reason why they make less of these if because it’s not good for the profit margin. The dial is probably the most difficult to make dial journe offers and the tantalum case is much more difficult to make than gold
So it’s probably more expensive to make than a gold CS... but they sell it for less.

The fact that waitlist are closed is a decision journe made because they were up to 7 years, that makes is rather stupid to keep on putting names on the list

Btw, the waiting list for the elegance is also closed when it reached 4 years.

But I don’t think these facts mean we can expect that they are going to discontinue it. Ofcourse one day they will but I don’t believe there are signs today
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Old 25 February 2021, 10:36 PM   #320
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Production is reduced because journe wants to make more complicated pieces.
So it went from about 200 per year to 100 ( this since 2019 I believe)
Another reason why they make less of these if because it’s not good for the profit margin. The dial is probably the most difficult to make dial journe offers and the tantalum case is much more difficult to make than gold
So it’s probably more expensive to make than a gold CS... but they sell it for less.

The fact that waitlist are closed is a decision journe made because they were up to 7 years, that makes is rather stupid to keep on putting names on the list

Btw, the waiting list for the elegance is also closed when it reached 4 years.

But I don’t think these facts mean we can expect that they are going to discontinue it. Ofcourse one day they will but I don’t believe there are signs today
Do you own a CB?
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Old 25 February 2021, 11:42 PM   #321
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Do you own a CB?
Why?
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Old 26 February 2021, 12:43 AM   #322
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Old 26 February 2021, 04:15 AM   #323
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Production is reduced because journe wants to make more complicated pieces.
So it went from about 200 per year to 100 ( this since 2019 I believe)
Another reason why they make less of these if because it’s not good for the profit margin. The dial is probably the most difficult to make dial journe offers and the tantalum case is much more difficult to make than gold
So it’s probably more expensive to make than a gold CS... but they sell it for less.

The fact that waitlist are closed is a decision journe made because they were up to 7 years, that makes is rather stupid to keep on putting names on the list

Btw, the waiting list for the elegance is also closed when it reached 4 years.

But I don’t think these facts mean we can expect that they are going to discontinue it. Ofcourse one day they will but I don’t believe there are signs today
I agree with this. Was just at the boutique this week and no indications they are going to discontinue this. That being said, FP himself isn't a fan of making this watch so who knows...
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Old 26 February 2021, 04:21 AM   #324
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I think this watch is a mistake in terms of profitability.
Big companies have a cost management department.
Journe doesn’t have an optimal cost management. Too expensive to produce with a low price.
That said, the CB permits to hype Journe collection.
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Old 27 February 2021, 04:51 AM   #325
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I adore this watch. I wonder if the CB will meet the same fate of the 5711 with prices shooting into the $100Ks after discontinuation. I hope the next CB will have an upgrade to the 1499 movement with hacking seconds or reset seconds like Akrivia, a new ridiculous type of medal, same 39mm size, and maybe skeletonized or outrageous colorful dial (orange, yellow, red) all while keeping the Journe signature and feel.

In the meantime, I am just enjoying it.




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Old 27 February 2021, 09:52 PM   #326
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I adore this watch. I wonder if the CB will meet the same fate of the 5711 with prices shooting into the $100Ks after discontinuation. I hope the next CB will have an upgrade to the 1499 movement with hacking seconds or reset seconds like Akrivia, a new ridiculous type of medal, same 39mm size, and maybe skeletonized or outrageous colorful dial (orange, yellow, red) all while keeping the Journe signature and feel.

In the meantime, I am just enjoying it.




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Correction: mov. 1304


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Old 28 February 2021, 12:18 AM   #327
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Correction: mov. 1304


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Since you live in Geneva and have access to Cuban cigars I have to ask, do you actually prefer non-Cuban cigars?
A new Chronometre Rouge with a dial color a la the Centigraphe F would be terrific, with yellow numerals.
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Old 28 February 2021, 09:34 AM   #328
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Since you live in Geneva and have access to Cuban cigars I have to ask, do you actually prefer non-Cuban cigars?
A new Chronometre Rouge with a dial color a la the Centigraphe F would be terrific, with yellow numerals.

I do love Cubans especially a Hoyo de Monterrey but I am enjoying the occasional shipments from the US co. Privada!

Chro. Rouge? Dig it!


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Old 15 April 2021, 02:44 AM   #329
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CB's blowing up again! Pretty solid result from Phillips.
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Old 15 April 2021, 04:20 AM   #330
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CB's blowing up again! Pretty solid result from Phillips.
That's just crazy! I remember having one in my hand at my local AD and thinking that adding a third blue dialed watch was stupid so I passed.
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