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28 July 2017, 02:49 AM | #61 |
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28 July 2017, 02:52 AM | #62 |
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28 July 2017, 03:02 AM | #63 | ||
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Anyways this thread sounds like an old movie from the 80's the the TV replays a few times a year, I am not very good at finding old threads, if someone could find it and post it to put this one to sleep it would be great |
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28 July 2017, 03:12 AM | #64 |
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In my opinion only a smallish part of their lineup is interesting and those pieces are hard to get or on the high price range. I have been underwhelmed with the newer pieces but do enjoy the older ones eh. 3940, 5035..
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28 July 2017, 03:23 AM | #65 |
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The recurrence of this theme, again and again and again, speaks volumes.
So it's not "getting old" - its not the "same as old threads" - You're getting a clearer and clearer indication that their issues are progressively getting worse.... ... now to the point where the whingers on TRF aren't the only people complaining. Journo's etc "in the trade" are noticing too. Take from that what you will. |
28 July 2017, 04:25 AM | #66 | |
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As for introducing new models and new sizes in order to court new buyers, well, this is necessary for survival, and our iworld all around us is changing at such a frentic pace, never seen before. Snobs and ancient buyers will often be quick to accuse a brand of selling out, but then if they don't adapt when these ancients die off so will the brand, so this widow burning is not the way ahead. |
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28 July 2017, 04:31 AM | #67 | |
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There are so many different styles to choose from, sure they probably overproduced with chinese market booming, they said would reduce production if I am not mistaken, let's wait and see, there's not one brand where I like all they do, don't think PP is going under anytime soon. About journos, most on msm are morons, not sure that's a quality |
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28 July 2017, 04:49 AM | #68 |
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The so called journalists just regurgitate what someone else wrote. Not a single one has an original thought. When I was doing my sis research before buying my car- read 100s of articles on the car. every single one said the same thing- the doors are difficult to close- watch out, you might bump your head.
Idiots!! of course you have to watch your head. But its the damn doors that makes the car!!! |
28 July 2017, 08:01 AM | #69 |
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28 July 2017, 08:11 AM | #70 |
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A company has a target audience and Patek Philippe will never be an end all and be all watch company for everyone.
Many people own both Patek and Rolex. However the target audience for these two brands are quite different. I would say the audience for Patek, VC and ALS are more similar, since their strengths lie in dress watches with complications. Although Patek makes some "sporty" watches, it is not their strength and has not been their focus. There are plenty of other brands that do sports watches better than Patek. Should Patek leave behind their DNA and transform itself into an AP, Hublot or RM? I would say that will kill the brand for sure. Are people looking for the latest trendy sports watches disappointed that Patek doesn't make a watch to their liking? I am quite sure many feel that way and move onto the next watch brand. Patek is aware of this, but they are not going to change their watch DNA to become a sports watch company. However they are adapting their business and watch models to cater to the younger generation. Younger watch enthusiasts want the larger watches and will not be caught dead wearing a 35mm Calatrava that their father wore. That is where the Aquanaut and Nautilus plays the crucial role for first time Patek buyers. As for service times, it is more significant in certain parts of the world, namely the US and certain parts of Asia. If you drop off your watch in Geneva, I believe the wait time is not that long. Patek has already created a watchmaker school in NYC and will boost their service department for the US market. However that will not solve service times for the next few years. More silicium parts in the movement will mean watches will not need to be serviced as often (theoretically at least, although we shall see). It is always good to see feedback from those who have considered the brand and decided not to buy into the brand. I am sure Patek appreciates that feedback. However once again to re-iterate, I don't think Patek wants or expects everyone to be their customer. They are not really competing with Rolex in becoming the watch manufacturer for the masses. As for the Grand Exhibition in NYC, they wanted people to understand the history of the company, the work that goes behind manufacturing one of their watches and how it is different from a mass-produced watch. |
28 July 2017, 08:24 AM | #71 | |
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Their watches look nothing like the other guys and while their dial designs on a FEW SELECT PIECES are a bit more modern, of the over 200 watches they fabricate, there are plenty of smaller 39mm traditional dials. Some of these comments are bordering on paranoia. |
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28 July 2017, 08:33 AM | #72 | |
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What I was trying to say is that Patek does not try to compete with these brands, not do they need to. However if people are interested in sports watches from these brands, they will be quite disappointed when they look at Patek since Patek does not make anything comparable. But that is ok since Patek is not trying to be an end all and be all for all watch enthusiasts. They have their target audience and they are not going to go out of their ways to become a sports watch company. |
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28 July 2017, 08:34 AM | #73 |
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Totally agree jon! Well said.
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28 July 2017, 09:53 AM | #74 |
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I see what you're saying however I don't think the issue of the OP was 'who Patek' is targeting in terms of their customer. There's always going to be a means for Patek because of who they are and what many WIS know what they represent. However for young people like myself who has only got his toes wet in terms of buying PP it's enough to detract from future purchases. The issue is their qc/service, which again, is making me hesitate pulling the trigger on another and go AP. I realize there's plenty of good instances of service out their for Patek but when people save signifacnt money (like me) for a significant amount of time, the "gamble" might not be worth it until they get things ratcheted up in terms of QC.
Full disclosure I LOVE Patek and think they design beautiful pieces from the sportier ones to the PCs. I'd love to have 10 different ones and the 5712 is my favorite watch on the market. I'm just on the fence right now in terms of the confidence I have in their work. I went to the exhibition in NYC and had a great time talking to the staff learning about their process, the pieces, and the history. others have said it served to bring awareness to their history of the brand and was a great "show". it may have brought in potential buyers that didn't know about the brand...but also those people don't know about the issues we speak of with qc and service times. Many not agree with this but some asked for thoughts from those who don't own a lot of pateks or are contemplating venturing into the brand. Sorry for the ramble. |
28 July 2017, 10:39 AM | #75 | |
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Well said But as pointed out --- their repair times and quality issues with some of the repairs is inexcusable
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28 July 2017, 11:08 AM | #76 |
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28 July 2017, 11:58 AM | #77 |
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Having problems with the PP value equation on other than the 5167 and 5711/12 and LEs and small run references. Based on current market pricing, I'm not alone.
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28 July 2017, 12:03 PM | #78 | |
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In the business world, most companies welcome feedback, including constructive criticism. However what they appreciate more are people offering realistic solutions for product and service improvement. |
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28 July 2017, 12:11 PM | #79 | |
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As to 'hiring' watchmakers, there are plenty available for them to hire that will probably exceed their requirements. |
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28 July 2017, 02:41 PM | #80 | |
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As for the journo / report? Going back to my post....can we really take this as serious journalism when soon after this he has an article on which is the best hipster watch? But then I haven't seen honest journalism where the brands advertise for ages. Anyway we fetter there....7 pages to go and no one took my bait on Lange...oh well |
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28 July 2017, 03:37 PM | #81 | ||
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I just don't see many Americans wanting to go into a field like watchmaking or any of the "old world" jobs. If there are 200 watchmakers in the US without jobs, I would think they can easily get another job in the industry with ease. However I can't see 200 watchmakers from the EU moving to the US, especially with the US becoming more and more anti-immigration. As mentioned earlier, Patek USA seems to suffer the most from service delays and not Patek Geneva. |
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28 July 2017, 04:43 PM | #82 |
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28 July 2017, 04:52 PM | #83 |
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28 July 2017, 06:25 PM | #84 |
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Service time is long because watchmakers are busy making new watches rather than servicing them. It pays to make new watches for these brands, servicing? Not so much.
For years owners have put up with it, we will see how long this can continue. At least now we can see a change in tune, I remember this topic has came up before in this forum but at the time the person who complained got flamed. All sorts of excuses were made for Patek, ranging from Pateks are intricate so they require more time to service, if you can't accept it then don't buy it, to if you can afford Patek, you should have other watches to wear in the meantime. |
28 July 2017, 09:47 PM | #85 | |
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Then again, maybe people when they meet him probably just tell him how they love Patek, they are the best, he is a hero, etc, etc...rather than stating what they really feel. |
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28 July 2017, 10:03 PM | #86 |
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I have 3 bought in 7 months, will send one or two, still have 3 watches to wear, it would bother me if I only had my 5712 and nothing else to wear, not the case
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29 July 2017, 12:50 AM | #87 | |
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29 July 2017, 12:55 AM | #88 |
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To me the real issue with service isn't the long time without your watch but wondering if it will come back fixed properly and in the same pristine condition it was in when you sent it in. That and the lack of communication about what exactly the problem is or was are what bothers me. When a person spends the kind of money you need to spend to own a Patek answers should be forthcoming. tom2517 in post #84 is correct in saying that just accepting it won't solve the problem and acceptance seems to be prevalent, I personally won't send a watch to HSWA, it will go to LA Watchworks even if it's under warranty. I had one come back from HSWA warranty work with scratches and marks, rather than send it back LA Watchworks took care of it in ten days! The watch is perfect now.
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29 July 2017, 01:57 AM | #89 | |
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29 July 2017, 01:59 AM | #90 | |
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