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Old 27 March 2020, 10:50 PM   #4021
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Old 27 March 2020, 10:55 PM   #4022
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gnuyork View Post
What to give people facts about what's really going on? Bias and facts are two different things.
If USA today said the sun would definitely rise tomorrow morning I would be sure we were all doomed. They lost their objectivity years ago.


Reuters and AP on the other hand still have a small remnant of objectivity left. I’m sure most of you trust their source so I’ll just leave this article right here.

https://news.trust.org/item/20200326232240-2yx1f
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Old 27 March 2020, 10:59 PM   #4023
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Originally Posted by Patton250 View Post
If USA today said the sun would definitely rise tomorrow morning I would be sure we were all doomed. They lost their objectivity years ago.


Reuters and AP on the other hand still have a small remnant of objectivity left. I’m sure most of you trust their source so I’ll just leave this article right here.

https://news.trust.org/item/20200326232240-2yx1f
lol. Third time using that analogy. OK.
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Old 27 March 2020, 10:59 PM   #4024
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The political comments are not necessary.....we ALL want to keep this thread open....
She made that comment in her capacity as White House Coronavirus Response Coordinator, not in the context of delivering frontline treatment.

what political commentary did Joey provide? I don't see any. he used the word "politician" as neutrally as saying "Abraham Lincoln was a politician
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:00 PM   #4025
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She made that comment in her capacity as White House Coronavirus Response Coordinator, not in the context of delivering frontline treatment.

what political commentary did Joey provide? I don't see any. he used the word "politician" as neutrally as saying "Abraham Lincoln was a politician
Thought so too...
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:05 PM   #4026
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lol. Third time using that analogy. OK.
Thank you. :-)

I’d love to get your thoughts on the article I linked.
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:08 PM   #4027
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Originally Posted by Star Ferry View Post
She made that comment in her capacity as White House Coronavirus Response Coordinator, not in the context of delivering frontline treatment.

what political commentary did Joey provide? I don't see any. he used the word "politician" as neutrally as saying "Abraham Lincoln was a politician
The comment in question quickly dismissed her comments as irrelevant or not accurate mentioning she was standing amongst political leaders and therefore because of this, (at least I took it this way) she had no objectivity.
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:12 PM   #4028
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The comment in question quickly dismissed her comments as irrelevant or not accurate mentioning she was standing amongst political leaders and therefore because of this, (at least I took it this way) she had no objectivity.
There are thousands of hospitals in this country, all making rapid decisions. I don't doubt her credibility, but practically how can one person know everything going on. Joey was talking about one colleague at one hospital, who seemed to be sharing information not yet in the public domain
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:15 PM   #4029
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Published this morning. My wife (a M.D.) told me last month this was likely going on with the test kits.

“ The coronavirus test that wasn’t: How federal health officials misled state scientists and derailed the best chance at containment”

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...OTMlcZ-vvM-4jE
There are many sides to this complicated situation and the writers of this article simply do not have the ability to gather all the facts because they are not privy to them. In addition, their sources are not properly cited and documented, thus not credible. Very irresponsible journalism.
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:19 PM   #4030
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Published this morning. My wife (a M.D.) told me last month this was likely going on with the test kits.

“ The coronavirus test that wasn’t: How federal health officials misled state scientists and derailed the best chance at containment”

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...OTMlcZ-vvM-4jE
I remember this tweet from Trump weeks before the whole thing gets blown out of proportion:

“The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!” "
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:21 PM   #4031
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The U.K. prime minister Boris Johnson just tested positive for the coronavirus. Right now only displaying mild symptoms.
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:23 PM   #4032
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There are thousands of hospitals in this country, all making rapid decisions. I don't doubt her credibility, but practically how can one person know everything going on. Joey was talking about one colleague at one hospital, who seemed to be sharing information not yet in the public domain
Well my friend it’s basically her job to know everything that’s going on. I suspect her somewhat positive message yesterday was not well received by some people.
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:23 PM   #4033
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Thank you. :-)

I’d love to get your thoughts on the article I linked.
read your article... if they told me the sun was going to rise tomorrow... I'm joking. See what I did there?
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:24 PM   #4034
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read your article... if they told me the sun was going to rise tomorrow... I'm joking. See what I did there?


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Old 27 March 2020, 11:29 PM   #4035
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Cheers, buddy. Brett, I know we disagree a lot (in this thread), but I am actually routing for you to be right, and hoping many of us are simply over reacting.
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:30 PM   #4036
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I remember this tweet from Trump weeks before the whole thing gets blown out of proportion:

“The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA. We are in contact with everyone and all relevant countries. CDC & World Health have been working hard and very smart. Stock Market starting to look very good to me!” "

We stay away from politics. Quick way to get banned.


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Old 27 March 2020, 11:37 PM   #4037
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Cheers, buddy. Brett, I know we disagree a lot (in this thread), but I am actually routing for you to be right, and hoping many of us are simply over reacting.
Thanks my friend. I appreciate that. I said it way back at the beginning of this thread and I’ll say it here again. I really don’t think this is going to be anywhere near the catastrophe the media has made it out to be. In the beginning it was 2 million in the United States would die. Then 1.5 million. Now they revised it down to 80,000–120,000. I’m praying those numbers will be revised even lower than that. I’m still extremely sad to see anyone sick or die. One is too many. I’m also very proud of the doctors, nurses and hospital staff and what they’re doing. Hard-working extremely brave and dedicated people. They all deserve a medal. But then they always have.

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We stay away from politics. Quick way to get banned.


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Indeed instantly. This thread has seen many people banned.
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Old 27 March 2020, 11:58 PM   #4038
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The political comments are not necessary.....we ALL want to keep this thread open....
I didn’t think that was a political comment. It pointed out the difference in thinking between two aspects of medicine. We deal with the differences every single day of practice. In good times and bad.
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Old 28 March 2020, 12:04 AM   #4039
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Well my friend it’s basically her job to know everything that’s going on. I suspect her somewhat positive message yesterday was not well received by some people.
Me being one of those people?
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Old 28 March 2020, 12:28 AM   #4040
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I live in CT. My office is in NYC. One client passed away from the virus a few days ago (had underlying issues, lupus, etc.) another attorney who I had known for 20 years passed away 2 days ago. He was 86 and family thinks he was exposed when he went to the hospital after a fall. So it has hit close to home, however, I am still optimistic that the numbers will not be anywhere near the doomsday predictions...
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Old 28 March 2020, 01:06 AM   #4041
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The US tested 100,000 yesterday! Yea!

15,000 (approximately) tested positive. Oh, no!

The US needs to keep it up. If testing stays in six figures (need it to) and positives get to 5%, then I think we can be optimistic about a light at the end of the tunnel.

Yesterday, NJ’s numbers jumped 50%. Now, it seems obvious that, given the situation in NYC, NJ (and Connecticut) would have a serious problem, too. I guess they didn’t have the test capacity to jump in until now. I expect those states’ numbers to start driving the US stats.

I live in Texas, which has a population eight times Connecticut ‘s, and close to the same number of cases. I think Texas testing has run 8-12% positive for the last few days. Keeping the test rate high while driving that % down is a good goal.

There are some states which believed they really didn’t have a problem, like Oklahoma. Those states are gradually being proven wrong- Oklahoma has had its case numbers jump 50% each of the last two days. Thank goodness the social distancing direction was nation wide (I wasn’t in favor, initially. Is it ok, on an anonymous message board, to admit I was wrong?).
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Old 28 March 2020, 01:15 AM   #4042
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There are some states which believed they really didn’t have a problem, like Oklahoma. Those states are gradually being proven wrong- Oklahoma has had its case numbers jump 50% each of the last two days. Thank goodness the social distancing direction was nation wide (I wasn’t in favor, initially. Is it ok, on an anonymous message board, to admit I was wrong?).
better late than never. We should all be part of the solution not the problem
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Old 28 March 2020, 01:33 AM   #4043
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The U.K. prime minister Boris Johnson just tested positive for the coronavirus. Right now only displaying mild symptoms.
Also

UK Health Secretary Matt Hancock has tested positive for the coronavirus. He is self-isolating at home and his symptoms are said to be mild
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Old 28 March 2020, 02:16 AM   #4044
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I didn’t think that was a political comment. It pointed out the difference in thinking between two aspects of medicine. We deal with the differences every single day of practice. In good times and bad.
I think that simply pointing out that (you think) that Dr. Birx’s comments and views differ from others in the medical field would have sufficed.
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Old 28 March 2020, 02:24 AM   #4045
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Chief Medical Officer of U.K. now self-isolating


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Old 28 March 2020, 02:34 AM   #4046
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Mortality rate of 4.5%

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Sorry if this has been covered before but how does this compare to other strains of influenza
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Old 28 March 2020, 02:45 AM   #4047
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Also

UK Health Secretary Matt Hancock has tested positive for the coronavirus. He is self-isolating at home and his symptoms are said to be mild
Well, I certainly hope they get better soon. No doubt, they’ve been working under immense pressure, navigating unfamiliar waters.

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Old 28 March 2020, 02:46 AM   #4048
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Sorry if this has been covered before but how does this compare to other strains of influenza
That 4.5% mortality rate figure has been lowered to 1%. That happened a couple weeks ago. Now they’re saying it’s going to fall below 1%. How far below we don’t know yet.
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Old 28 March 2020, 02:48 AM   #4049
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Here is an article reporting that some hospital are considering universal Do Not Resuscitate ("DNR") orders for Covid-19 patients.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...ot-resucitate/

This should drive home the seriousness of the disease and the threat heathcare workers are facing.

Stay safe.
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I think it's prudent to have this discussion among providers. Even the most efficient resuscitative efforts are not as effective as we'd like to believe. I'm not an intensivist and not versed with the numbers, but it's probably safe to say that greater than 50% of patients who would require CPR for an arrhythmia will die despite best efforts, and that a significant portion of those who survive initially may not survive until discharge. The studied populations tend to have cardiovascular disease and often accompanying chronic lung disease if they were smokers.

When you compound the situation with patients who have severe ACUTE on chronic respiratory compromise in addition to cardiovascular disease and arrhythmia, I'm sure the numbers are much worse. In this case, the calculus needs to be done. Is it worth throwing a team of 10-15 healthcare workers into the exercise of CPR when you may only save 1 in 5, or more likely 1 in 20 patients, with the risk of infecting at least 10% of that team in the best case? When the virus is aerosolized, it is remarkably infectious. There are anecdotal reports from the ENT community in Iran where a sinus surgery performed with protective gear (N95 masks, gown, gloves, hair covers, face shields, but not full PPE with PAPR) likely resulted in the infection of an entire team.

It's a horrible set of decisions and policies that are being made and penned now respectively. There is no good or palatable choice, only several bad options. I have several friends from medical school on the front lines right now, and they are giving everything they've got. I don't think it's unreasonable to consider nurses, respiratory therapists, docs, environmental cleaning, etc. services to be irreplaceable resources. We need time to get proper protective gear for providers, and part of that will be making these tough decisions up front, rather than too late.
I have to say this is pretty weak. Not your posts of course, but the perspective being considered by some systems. In realty, it could cut down transmission assuming every hospital actually had a proper division for highly infectious transmissions and sealed barriers and PROPER protocol that was practiced each and every time. That said they are only fooling themselves if they think they aren't already exposed to aerosol virus just by being in the same wing as another provider that is caring for a sick individual. Or by sharing a common HVAC. At that point are they really minimizing exposures with these proposed changes. I highly doubt it. Unless every provider in the entire building is being properly showered and change of clothes and going thru staging areas, these changes make minimal impact anyway. It's part of the oath to serve, to put others first in any public service position. If that's not possible, you shouldn't serve. All of these procedures should've been considered prior, and the systems not have run on a just in time delivery method of service. With the aging and shifts in demographics in many countries it's probably about time we get better at taking care of our elderly. Taking care of your young and elderly is society's most important mission. The above is just my opinion, but I have to think we can surely do better.
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Old 28 March 2020, 02:50 AM   #4050
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Yet you just linked that hit piece from a remarkably biased newspaper that was written to accomplish one thing?
1) my post isn’t a link to a hit job.
2) Actually, USA Today isn't too bad for facts, they are nothing like cnn and fox in terms of learning too far right or left w/ opinions when presenting facts.

In this age, left and right center least bias is the best we get next to something like fact-check.org.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/usa-today-2/

3) Plus my wife is in the middle of this from the hospital view. Many docs knew something was going on (or lack of) last month. Plus this virus has been a tricky one. We are learning more & more about it through testing. Unfortunately, hospitals are just getting swamped at once now. Sad for everyone.

It is what it is. Unfortunately, it's a very hard lesson learnt despite having checks and balances in-place.
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