The Rolex Forums   The Rolex Watch

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX


Go Back   Rolex Forums - Rolex Watch Forum > Classifieds > WatchOut!!!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 13 January 2023, 03:37 AM   #2731
Vince_76
"TRF" Member
 
Vince_76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Orange County
Posts: 1,516
I know an SA at WoS who specifically said it’s very slow. Among other data points.
__________________
AP 15500ST (Silver) // ♛ Rolex 126334 (Blue Roman, Fluted, Jubilee) // Ω Moonswatch (Mission to Pluto) // G-Shock GA2100-1A1
Vince_76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 03:39 AM   #2732
psm11
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Watch: AP 15500
Posts: 697
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trailboss516 View Post
Demand will always be high for some markets & some models, the way it always has been. However, I'm sure the ADs are instructing staff to avoid saying things like "oh my goodness it is CRICKETS!" or "Well, you're the 11th person I had to call to sell this watch!" It is in their interest to milk this as long as possible and maintain that air of exclusivity. If all of a sudden everything is available for everyone, the allure will likely vanish. What good would it do for an AD or SA to say the market is down?
For what it is worth, 3 months ago my SA at AP was upfront and admitted to me that things were slowing down and he expected that some pieces would be in the cases in 2023. Will any RO? He said probably not. Any AD that states things haven't changed are full of it. Yes of course, the hype models are still in demand but ladies pieces and PM are not. I went to Rolex a few weeks ago inquiring about a ladies piece and you would have thought I asked for a Daytona and was quickly dismissed (same piece that has been siting unsold on Moda for months). It's all smoke and mirrors.
psm11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 04:01 AM   #2733
Rolextellstime
"TRF" Member
 
Rolextellstime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Real Name: Ken
Location: Canada
Watch: Rolex 116610LV
Posts: 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince_76 View Post
I know an SA at WoS who specifically said it’s very slow. Among other data points.
I visited an AD in my area as I happen to be driving by and popped in, this was just after the new year. To my surprise the SA also admitted how slow it was even during Christmas and that there is a lot less foot traffic.

Sent from my SM-S908W using Tapatalk
Rolextellstime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 05:11 AM   #2734
jgrae
"TRF" Member
 
jgrae's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Philly Suburbs
Posts: 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolextellstime View Post
I visited an AD in my area as I happen to be driving by and popped in, this was just after the new year. To my surprise the SA also admitted how slow it was even during Christmas and that there is a lot less foot traffic.

Sent from my SM-S908W using Tapatalk
If ADs want foot traffic perhaps they can carry some stock. Something for people to look at and try on at least. Walking into an AD and being told "of course we have no inventory" is humiliating.
jgrae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 05:22 AM   #2735
Mr Ben
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2022
Location: UK
Watch: 226570
Posts: 650
I’ll be able to tell you exactly when AD’s are starting to struggle. I’ve had my interest noted for a 124060 forever and the SA confirmed they would take me on but I’m right at the bottom of their list. As soon as they’ve phoned me, the lists are done and stuff will start appearing in store!
Mr Ben is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 05:45 AM   #2736
messikens
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2021
Location: SFO
Posts: 986
Quote:
Originally Posted by jgrae View Post
If ADs want foot traffic perhaps they can carry some stock. Something for people to look at and try on at least. Walking into an AD and being told "of course we have no inventory" is humiliating.

I agree - I've come to accept that there's no stock at AD or boutiques. But I'd rather visit an AP house and actually try on a few pieces and spend 45 minutes chatting watches and getting a coffee.

Last time my visit to the Rolex boutique was a joke. SA is completely disinterested and barely makes eye contact, only a TT daytona, a BLNR and a black SkyD as expo models (otherwise almost barren) and couples trying on 31mm OPs. I mean what's the point of this?

Add to that the other sales staff from Tudor was entirely inexperienced and could not even answer a basic strap cost question (the answer was "probably between $100-$200 but I don't really know"...)?!?
messikens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 06:52 AM   #2737
Michigan_State
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Real Name: Vince
Location: Michigan
Posts: 547
haven’t visited my AD for a long time. Plotting, hoping, chatting, casually stopping by, being on lists, all in an attempt to just buy a watch is simply belittling. I will be back once things return to normal (if ever).
__________________
Have a nice day!
Michigan_State is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 09:26 AM   #2738
Vince_76
"TRF" Member
 
Vince_76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Orange County
Posts: 1,516
Daytona panda full set, April 2022, sold for 26k. A new low.
__________________
AP 15500ST (Silver) // ♛ Rolex 126334 (Blue Roman, Fluted, Jubilee) // Ω Moonswatch (Mission to Pluto) // G-Shock GA2100-1A1
Vince_76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 10:35 AM   #2739
Swiftneck
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: denmark
Posts: 197
Most watches listed on grey sites or chrone24 in my area are consigment watches to make the market look higher.

Then the grey then list their own watches directly in different sales group as great offers at least 10-15 % cheaper. These watches do actually often sell, too unaware customers, so I think their strategy works, and they get their own watches which they been buying cheap sold with higher margin, and keeping business going.

Those greys holding large stock have much bigger problem's even though this strategy also help them slowly decrease stock at reasonable prices.

We don't have many grey with big stock in my area, though. So the listed prices are keept high still, and the ongoing price reduction is mainly driven by private sellers in different sales groups.

Many private sellers have lost a lot of money while their watches have been kept hostages in consignment at unrealistic prices. I think we will see the race to the bottom when these private sellers lose patience and start dumping their watches on the market them self, which will make their losses even bigger.





Sendt fra min SM-F711B med Tapatalk
Swiftneck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 11:00 AM   #2740
train-time
"TRF" Member
 
train-time's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Maryland USA
Watch: All gone!
Posts: 3,998
I don't know exactly how it is going this month as I haven't been to visit my AD since December, but he told me back then that the period covering September through November had been the slowest that they have had in the last few years. Previously during the Pandemic, he told me that they had broken sales records month after month. December is the time he started texting me with pictures of new pieces that had come in and were available for purchase. I passed....
train-time is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 12:32 PM   #2741
Etschell
"TRF" Member
 
Etschell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: FL
Watch: platinum sub
Posts: 15,861
It will revert to mean along with cars.
__________________
If you wind it, they will run.

25 or 6 to 4.
Etschell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 12:51 PM   #2742
Mathematoxic
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2022
Location: Asia
Posts: 419
April 2022 pre-owned panda Daytona asking price $26k, sold. About 2 hours ago.
Mathematoxic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 12:56 PM   #2743
jgrae
"TRF" Member
 
jgrae's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Philly Suburbs
Posts: 55
"I've seen gluts not followed by shortages, but I've never seen a shortage not followed by a glut." -- Nassim Taleb
jgrae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 05:01 PM   #2744
GGGMT
2024 Pledge Member
 
GGGMT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Itinerant
Watch: 79010sg
Posts: 7,806
Quote:
Originally Posted by jgrae View Post
"I've seen gluts not followed by shortages, but I've never seen a shortage not followed by a glut." -- Nassim Taleb

Who’s nassim?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
GGGMT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 05:21 PM   #2745
ExplorerI
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: USA
Watch: Explorer I
Posts: 717
Guy just said he had 2 Royal oak Jumbo blue dials one at 50k and one at 54k. Haven’t seen those prices in a while for the jumbo.
ExplorerI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 January 2023, 10:53 PM   #2746
hotchicken
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Australia
Posts: 21
this thread is awesome, it's like we are documenting the demand and price falls in real time. history in the making, it's exciting lol
hotchicken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 12:04 AM   #2747
amh
"TRF" Member
 
amh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Tejas
Watch: Various
Posts: 5,082
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolextellstime View Post
I visited an AD in my area as I happen to be driving by and popped in, this was just after the new year. To my surprise the SA also admitted how slow it was even during Christmas and that there is a lot less foot traffic.

Sent from my SM-S908W using Tapatalk
This news pleases me. Let's see how long it takes them to remove the $50k jewelry requirement prior to an SS "allocation"
amh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 01:44 AM   #2748
911AP
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince_76 View Post
Not really. Call a dealer and see what they’d offer you for some pieces. Either consignment or major lowball.

As for MODA, there’s plenty of mint/BNIB stock. And note that most active participants are brick and mortar greys/TRF trusted sellers/reputable dealers.
I have called a dealer. They give pricing in line with what other grey dealers give. I'm still being offered over 2x for some of my watches if I were to sell. I'm not sure what dealers you are speaking with. If you talk to some backpack flipper then I'm sure they will give a horrible offer. But respectable large grey's, are still giving decent pricing close to the selling prices they are asking for. Though any dealer I have spoke to always preferred consignment even during the craze. They always low ball if you offer to sell it to them outright. Consignment is always the way to go for years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by *M5 View Post
I'd also like to contribute my findings from Moda. Joined over a month ago.

I am a buyer right now for several models from Rolex, AP and Patek.

The listings that are on the cheaper side on MODA are NOT watches I would buy, they look either polished to death, beat up, missing links, papers etc OR they sell VERY fast.

As for the rest, there are plenty of SS Daytonas in the 25-30 range but that is still significant over MSRP.

I only joined MODA because of all the talk in this particular thread but to me personally there are not a lot of great deals to be had.


This is not to say that the market may not be coming down, but to draw attention that MODA is not entirely representative of the market in my eyes as the stock for sale there may not be for the average buyer.

Even if dealers deal there, when you turn around and shop on Chrono24 or Grey big websites, well we alk know how those prices are looking.


MODA is more like the auction block for cars, dealers can turn around, add links, polish, add a box and ask for a bigger premium afterwards, cause most of those watches are seriously sketchy.

Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk
Glad someone whom isn't the usual suspects shed some light on what I have been saying for a while now.
911AP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 01:45 AM   #2749
911AP
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 445
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExplorerI View Post
Guy just said he had 2 Royal oak Jumbo blue dials one at 50k and one at 54k. Haven’t seen those prices in a while for the jumbo.
What guy? What year? What condition? These are all important details.
911AP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 01:57 AM   #2750
Nicof
"TRF" Member
 
Nicof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: New York
Posts: 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by 911AP View Post
I have called a dealer. They give pricing in line with what other grey dealers give. I'm still being offered over 2x for some of my watches if I were to sell. I'm not sure what dealers you are speaking with. If you talk to some backpack flipper then I'm sure they will give a horrible offer. But respectable large grey's, are still giving decent pricing close to the selling prices they are asking for. Though any dealer I have spoke to always preferred consignment even during the craze. They always low ball if you offer to sell it to them outright. Consignment is always the way to go for years.



Glad someone whom isn't the usual suspects shed some light on what I have been saying for a while now.

So you say you’ve been getting offered 2x times retail but then say it is actually for consignment…it’s not exactly the same thing is it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Nicof is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 02:08 AM   #2751
Vince_76
"TRF" Member
 
Vince_76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Orange County
Posts: 1,516
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicof View Post
So you say you’ve been getting offered 2x times retail but then say it is actually for consignment…it’s not exactly the same thing is it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Exactly. 911 - please list the greys that are offering 2x and for what model?

I have called brick and mortar greys, and established dealers - a lot of no offers and definitely not 2x on “hype” references.
__________________
AP 15500ST (Silver) // ♛ Rolex 126334 (Blue Roman, Fluted, Jubilee) // Ω Moonswatch (Mission to Pluto) // G-Shock GA2100-1A1
Vince_76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 02:56 AM   #2752
Rolextellstime
"TRF" Member
 
Rolextellstime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Real Name: Ken
Location: Canada
Watch: Rolex 116610LV
Posts: 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince_76 View Post
Exactly. 911 - please list the greys that are offering 2x and for what model?



I have called brick and mortar greys, and established dealers - a lot of no offers and definitely not 2x on “hype” references.
He actually said, quote

They always low ball if you offer to sell it to them outright. Consignment is always the way to go for years. End quote

Which I understand as, if the grey is buying it it is at basement price, but on consignment he will list it at 2x msrp so that the grey can sell his watches easier, meanwhile you the customer are happy hoping to get 2x mrp which will never happen, at least not in this 2023

Sent from my SM-S908W using Tapatalk
Rolextellstime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 03:31 AM   #2753
Vince_76
"TRF" Member
 
Vince_76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Orange County
Posts: 1,516
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolextellstime View Post
He actually said, quote

They always low ball if you offer to sell it to them outright. Consignment is always the way to go for years. End quote

Which I understand as, if the grey is buying it it is at basement price, but on consignment he will list it at 2x msrp so that the grey can sell his watches easier, meanwhile you the customer are happy hoping to get 2x mrp which will never happen, at least not in this 2023

Sent from my SM-S908W using Tapatalk
So essentially he’s typing but not saying much. LOL got it
__________________
AP 15500ST (Silver) // ♛ Rolex 126334 (Blue Roman, Fluted, Jubilee) // Ω Moonswatch (Mission to Pluto) // G-Shock GA2100-1A1
Vince_76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 03:42 AM   #2754
onyourbikes
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2022
Location: Earth
Posts: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince_76 View Post
So essentially he’s typing but not saying much. LOL got it
No, he's in fact saying a lot. He just isn't saying what he thinks.

He's saying he isn't getting a monetary offer at all because watches are not selling.

He is however getting an offer to fund his grey dealer's marketing projects by allowing him to list his watch, at no cost to the dealer, at a stupidly high price to keep the illusion going......


I'm off to my AD this morning to try and find my kid a new watch with hands so she can hand her g shock down to the younger kid. I'll see how it seems for grown up watches when I'm there too..
onyourbikes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 03:47 AM   #2755
Vince_76
"TRF" Member
 
Vince_76's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Orange County
Posts: 1,516
Quote:
Originally Posted by onyourbikes View Post
No, he's in fact saying a lot. He just isn't saying what he thinks.

He's saying he isn't getting a monetary offer at all because watches are not selling.

He is however getting an offer to fund his grey dealer's marketing projects by allowing him to list his watch, at no cost to the dealer, at a stupidly high price to keep the illusion going......


I'm off to my AD this morning to try and find my kid a new watch with hands so she can hand her g shock down to the younger kid. I'll see how it seems for grown up watches when I'm there too..
Thanks for clarifying. Yes, exactly what’s going on on Chrono and even to a degree in MODA. Let us know how the search goes and good luck!
__________________
AP 15500ST (Silver) // ♛ Rolex 126334 (Blue Roman, Fluted, Jubilee) // Ω Moonswatch (Mission to Pluto) // G-Shock GA2100-1A1
Vince_76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 09:37 AM   #2756
Laostuh
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 947
I purchased my 116500 off Moda few months ago. Seamless transaction, and I would do it again. Got fair market value for my Hulk and what I thought was a good price at the time for the Daytona. Obviously the values have dipped a little but I can careless. Don't get me wrong.. I'd gladly give the AD my money... They just dont want it LOL..
Laostuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 12:49 PM   #2757
911AP
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolextellstime View Post
He actually said, quote

They always low ball if you offer to sell it to them outright. Consignment is always the way to go for years. End quote

Which I understand as, if the grey is buying it it is at basement price, but on consignment he will list it at 2x msrp so that the grey can sell his watches easier, meanwhile you the customer are happy hoping to get 2x mrp which will never happen, at least not in this 2023

Sent from my SM-S908W using Tapatalk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince_76 View Post
Exactly. 911 - please list the greys that are offering 2x and for what model?

I have called brick and mortar greys, and established dealers - a lot of no offers and definitely not 2x on “hype” references.
Let me clarify with an example. Let's take a 15202st for example. Retail is roughly 30k. If you consign it they sell it for 60-70k. If you sell it to them they want 50-55k.

This spread is the same when I was offered 160k for my jumbo and that grey was selling them for 180k.

That was my point. Consignment is always better if you want top dollar. If you don't care to leave some money on the table sell it outright. Some people may not care about 5k if they are already making 100% return, or 20k if they are making 500% return.
911AP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 12:53 PM   #2758
911AP
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: USA
Posts: 445
Quote:
Originally Posted by onyourbikes View Post
No, he's in fact saying a lot. He just isn't saying what he thinks.

He's saying he isn't getting a monetary offer at all because watches are not selling.

He is however getting an offer to fund his grey dealer's marketing projects by allowing him to list his watch, at no cost to the dealer, at a stupidly high price to keep the illusion going......


I'm off to my AD this morning to try and find my kid a new watch with hands so she can hand her g shock down to the younger kid. I'll see how it seems for grown up watches when I'm there too..

This is for backpack newbie dealers sure I agree. Not for bigger grey's. They don't want to sit on the watch. They won't even take it for sale in my experience. My friend wanted to sell his Omega through a grey dealer I have bought watches from. He wanted a number 10-15% above what the grey dealer would ask for it. The dealer refused to take it. He said take it to someone else who doesn't mind sitting on it.

You guys can't treat all grey dealers the same......There is a reason some of them revenue 100+ mil a year and growing. It's not from sitting on inventory.
911AP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 01:39 PM   #2759
Conway
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2022
Location: UK
Posts: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by 911AP View Post
Let me clarify with an example. Let's take a 15202st for example. Retail is roughly 30k. If you consign it they sell it for 60-70k. If you sell it to them they want 50-55k.
If you consign it they will advertise it for 60-70k.

And frankly I don't believe a dealer will give you 50-55k in a cash sale, no dealer I know would. Can you name them because I've got watches that I'd sell if any dealers are giving good prices.

As I keep saying, it's all just pie in the sky, we can talk all we want on here but the only thing that matters is cash in your hand and I know what I know.
Conway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 January 2023, 03:04 PM   #2760
Nicof
"TRF" Member
 
Nicof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: New York
Posts: 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Conway View Post
If you consign it they will advertise it for 60-70k.

And frankly I don't believe a dealer will give you 50-55k in a cash sale, no dealer I know would. Can you name them because I've got watches that I'd sell if any dealers are giving good prices.

As I keep saying, it's all just pie in the sky, we can talk all we want on here but the only thing that matters is cash in your hand and I know what I know.

Exactly…my 15202st has now been siting on a respected dealer’s website for two months on consignment at the lowest price out there and there’s basically zero interest. Not one dealer was interested in buying it outright at any price and several didn’t even want to consign it if they answered at all.

The watch is in excellent condition and full set so it’s not like it’s a dud…the market and AP in particular is just extremely slow.

People who believe the contrary are truly delusional at this point.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Nicof is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 3 (1 members and 2 guests)
Boreor
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Coronet

Takuya Watches

Bobs Watches

OCWatches

Asset Appeal

My Watch LLC

DavidSW Watches


*Banners Of The Month*
This space is provided to horological resources.





Copyright ©2004-2024, The Rolex Forums. All Rights Reserved.

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

Rolex is a registered trademark of ROLEX USA. The Rolex Forums is not affiliated with ROLEX USA in any way.