Help with 1675 please!

[shammad10]

Hi guys,
Just wanted some help with a 1675 please.
It’s a 2.1XXmil serial from 1968.
I understand a MK1 dial with the long E.
Does it look relumed? The seller says no.

Later bracelet, looks like maybe later hands and bezel too? Bezel insert looks later as well.

Case seems nice and sharp?

What do you guys think? Thanks!












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[springer]

I think a good place to start with this watch would be to start at the top and then, work my way down. First off, it wears a fake bezel insert, a service bezel, oil marks on the hands, degrading dial lume (whether relumed or not) an average condition case with somewhat thin-appearing lugs, and a later replacement bracelet.

With that said, the watch seems to be one of the "common" types being offered for sale lately - being one with issues - but, this isn't that uncommon with 55-year-old watches. They can have issues and replacement parts. Hopefully my observations were disclosed to you by the seller. Proceed accordingly and have a nice day.

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by springer

I think a good place to start with this watch would be to start at the top and then, work my way down. First off, it wears a fake bezel insert, a service bezel, oil marks on the hands, degrading dial lume (whether relumed or not) an over-polished case and a later replacement bracelet.

With that said, the watch seems to be one of the "common" types being offered for sale lately - being one with issues - but, this isn't that uncommon with 55-year-old watches. They can have issues and replacement parts. Hopefully my observations were disclosed to you by the seller. Proceed accordingly and have a nice day.

Thanks!
Nope the bezel insert not disclosed. I had figured about the service bezel and could see the oil on the hands.
Priced very well, but I guess the condition then is not good enough.

[rootbeer7]

I would trust Springer implicitly as the GMT expert, although for me the case isn’t too bad and a later bracelet has its advantages. The dial and hands put me off, as does the bezel insert all of which are expensive to make good.

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by rootbeer7

I would trust Springer implicitly as the GMT expert, although for me the case isn’t too bad and a later bracelet has its advantages. The dial and hands put me off, as does the bezel insert all of which are expensive to make good.

The seller is adamant that the bezel insert is genuine Rolex, but not the one that came on the watch obviously.
I agree about the lume degradation, and the bottom right lug is a bit thin too.

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by shammad10

The seller is adamant that the bezel insert is genuine Rolex, but not the one that came on the watch obviously.
I agree about the lume degradation, and the bottom right lug is a bit thin too.

However looking at the bezel insert, the change in colour at the '6' is not in the middle of the number. So I would agree that not genuine.

[TimeToGo]

.
....or you can just look at the big a$$ HOOKED 2's and determine that..

[Dan S]

It is the most well-known aftermarket insert, so common that it has a name. Respectfully, I suggest that you might want to study a little more or you are going to be scammed by an unscrupulous seller.

[rootbeer7]

OP who is the selller? Uk based?

[BigBlue1]

Originally Posted by shammad10

The seller is adamant that the bezel insert is genuine Rolex, but not the one that came on the watch obviously.
I agree about the lume degradation, and the bottom right lug is a bit thin too.

The seller can be as adamant as he or she wants but trust Springer, especially when it comes to GMT. He is an expert. I value his opinion as does everyone else around here. If your ok with what has been presented to you go for it, if not keep looking. Be patient and the right one will come around.

[Arnozerosix]

Most time seller do not even know how to recognize a fake or original bezel insert.
I remember once having one of my fiend buying a fat font serif... and explaining the seller (a pro known on the place) how to differentiate a genuine stuff from the fake one...

To my eyes, the "22"of this one is screaming fake....

[Arnozerosix]

Not just the bezel, but the one who polished this watch is certainly not a professional....
I would obviously run away from this seller...

[shammad10]

Thanks for all your replies!
I'll avoid this deal then!
Yes he's a UK dealer and seems to be quite genuine and well respected. Maybe I'll approach him tomorrow again and try and explain about the bezel insert, see what he says.

[Stan Cooper]

The insert is aftermarket. The base of the 2s in 22 is a straight line instead of following the curve of the bezel circumference as the Rolex inserts do. Also, the hooked 2s are pretty obvious.

[stevegeorge249]

Originally Posted by shammad10

The seller is adamant that the bezel insert is genuine Rolex, but not the one that came on the watch obviously.
I agree about the lume degradation, and the bottom right lug is a bit thin too.

I like an aftermarket bezel insert but that is pretty bad.
It really does spoilt the watch.
Min 3k for a reasonable insert, 7k for a fuchsia.

A wise man once said " buy the seller!" and if that seller is insisting that is a genuine Rolex insert...........

Run Forrest RUN!!

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Yes he's a UK dealer and seems to be quite genuine and well respected. Maybe I'll approach him tomorrow again and try and explain about the bezel insert, see what he says.

Who is the dealer? Either he knows very little about vintage Rolex or he is being deceptive.

[TuRo]

Folks - Just hold finger on the image for 2 secs and a drop down list appears - the last item is ‘search google for this image’ the dealer is then shown…..I use this facility on EVERY eBay or private or dealer sale to check image not been hijacked !

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by Stan Cooper

The insert is aftermarket. The base of the 2s in 22 is a straight line instead of following the curve of the bezel circumference as the Rolex inserts do. Also, the hooked 2s are pretty obvious.

Thanks, that's a great pic.

Does anyone have any other material to read and learn about the different inserts please? So I can educate myself as Dan suggested!

[shammad10]

Is this what’s called a ‘serif bezel’ on this 16710? Usually on GMTs From late 80s to mid 90s?
Just trying to learn!





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[Dan S]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Thanks, that's a great pic.

Does anyone have any other material to read and learn about the different inserts please? So I can educate myself as Dan suggested!

Here's a start. I was aware of these from previous reading, but just found them again using google. You may find more if you search.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=462474
https://gmtmaster1675.com/the-bezel/

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Here's a start. I was aware of these from previous reading, but just found them again using google. You may find more if you search.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=462474
https://gmtmaster1675.com/the-bezel/

Thanks!

[Stan Cooper]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Is this what’s called a ‘serif bezel’ on this 16710? Usually on GMTs From late 80s to mid 90s?
Just trying to learn!

Yes; that is a serif font bezel insert, but it was used at least into the early 2000s. This is my 16710N purchased new in May, 2001, with its original noir serif insert.

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by Stan Cooper

Yes; that is a serif font bezel insert, but it was used at least into the early 2000s. This is my 16710N purchased new in May, 2001, with its original noir serif insert.

Thanks Stan.
Do they still provide those inserts from RSC for example? The watch above for example has obviously been to RSC and has that insert.
Or do they now only provide thin font?

[Filipão]

16700 - the thinnest SS sports Rolex - circa 1998 #U677.XXX also with serifed insert.

[Filipão]

Originally Posted by TuRo

Folks - Just hold finger on the image for 2 secs and a drop down list appears - the last item is ‘search google for this image’ the dealer is then shown…..I use this facility on EVERY eBay or private or dealer sale to check image not been hijacked !

Dealer omits the insert. So cunning...

[TimeLord2]

Originally Posted by TuRo

Folks - Just hold finger on the image for 2 secs and a drop down list appears - the last item is ‘search google for this image’ the dealer is then shown…..I use this facility on EVERY eBay or private or dealer sale to check image not been hijacked !

Great advice!

[springer]

Originally Posted by shammad10

Is this what’s called a ‘serif bezel’ on this 16710? Usually on GMTs From late 80s to mid 90s?
Just trying to learn!





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late 80s didn't have serifs.

[shammad10]

Originally Posted by springer

late 80s didn't have serifs.

Thanks JP. So 90's to early 00's?

Is there a reason you don't see many faded full black sapphire inserts? I've seen a few of the acrylic ones.