Help on a Daytona 16520 Patrizzi..

[1665fan]

Unpolished beauty!

[kay13]

Thanks again Aaron. For the detail obsevation and the comparison Pictures.

[swish77]

Originally Posted by kay13

Thanks again Aaron. For the detail obsevation and the comparison Pictures.

Any time. Good luck in the search.

I'm looking for a good example myself. Another issue is the lacquer on the dials of these black 16520s. I just saw an X-serial example that looked perfect ... except when louped at an angle, and it showed tiny little pimples throughout the dial surface. (It's the one I saw in Tokyo posted earlier in this thread.)

Always tough when buying from photos. I'd only ever purchase from photos at this price point if the seller had a no-questions-asked return policy, and always better to see in person, of course.

[kay13]

Aaron, I am going back to the seller trying to negotiate and purchase the Patrizzi 16520 that I originaly posted , I really like that one and you also thought it was a good example on your first comment but to expensive.
Can you please take another detail look and tell me of any negatives, I really would appreciate it.
Any expert's eye that can help out would be appreciated.

https://imgur.com/LWWFjxv
https://imgur.com/CiAyxJ1
https://imgur.com/7Xrol9m
https://imgur.com/oJukCHS

[1665fan]

Looks good just needs the 3-4K $ proper bezel....

[kay13]

Thanks. If the only flaw is the newer bezel, I can live with that until I come across a period correct bezel at the right price to replace.
I am concerned about other flaws such as the dial, soft case/overpolish, any red flags, etc.
I would appreciate any comments from the experienced eyes.

https://imgur.com/LWWFjxv
https://imgur.com/CiAyxJ1
https://imgur.com/7Xrol9m
https://imgur.com/oJukCHS

[swish77]

I don't see any red flags just based on these bad whitebox photos, but I'd ask for natural light photos, and a lot of them.

So many other questions too, service history being one of them. Servicing a Zenith movement will cost about $1500, so there's that. Have you seen photos of the movement? Blacklight photo of the dial? Not a lot to ask for a watch that is presumably well north of $20K. Annoys me when I see better photos on Craigslist for a used $50 Ikea couch.

If you like the patina, and you're OK with the case and the price, and the seller has impeccable references, I think you'll have your answer.

Personally, I'd never buy a black 16520 with such dark patina on the sub-dials unless I knew 100 percent that it occurred naturally. (I also prefer them when the patina is milder.)

For the record, here is what an unpolished 16520 case looks like for comparison. Way too many listings out there for these classic Zenith Daytonas that claim "unpolished." If the case isn't as fat as this one, it ain't unpolished. Look how thick these lugs are:

https://rarebirds.de/product/rolex-d...ies-unpolished

[kay13]

Thanks for any comments on this Daytona 16520 Patrizzi.

[ratty]

Originally Posted by kay13

Thanks. If the only flaw is the newer bezel, I can live with that until I come across a period correct bezel at the right price to replace.
I am concerned about other flaws such as the dial, soft case/overpolish, any red flags, etc.
I would appreciate any comments from the experienced eyes.

https://imgur.com/LWWFjxv
https://imgur.com/CiAyxJ1
https://imgur.com/7Xrol9m
https://imgur.com/oJukCHS

What's wrong with the bezel, is it a service replacement?

Thanks

[1665fan]

Yes service bezel

[ratty]

How are service bezels identified, is it to do with the 6 in the 160?

[swish77]

Originally Posted by ratty

How are service bezels identified, is it to do with the 6 in the 160?

It's slightly misleading to call it a "service" bezel, because there were some late 16520s (and some 116520s) that left the factory with that style of bezel. It's basically the last type that was used, aka MK6, and also the type that was used as a replacement during a service. (Easy to ID by the spacing of the letters in "Units Per Hour.")

Here's a good breakdown of the different types of bezels on the 16520s:

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vint...as-t17026.html

[kay13]

Comparing with the nonpolished examples, and aknowledging the not so good pictures I have from the watch, it obviously is polished, but doesnt look too bad, over polished / soft case! I think..

[ratty]

Originally Posted by swish77

It's slightly misleading to call it a "service" bezel, because there were some late 16520s (and some 116520s) that left the factory with that style of bezel. It's basically the last type that was used, aka MK6, and also the type that was used as a replacement during a service. (Easy to ID by the spacing of the letters in "Units Per Hour.")

Here's a good breakdown of the different types of bezels on the 16520s:

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/vint...as-t17026.html

Thanks very much for this.

I knew about the first two, the 50 to 200 and the 225 version, and I knew that some bezels have a different 6 in the 160, but the rest is new to me. Do all SS 116520s have the mk 6 version or are there variations in these as well?

Also, is there a list of the order in which different letters were used in serial numbers? I know I've seen one on here somewhere but can't find it. I also know that any list is a rough guide because watches were not always sold in order so there is overlapping.

Thanks again.

[1665fan]

All 116520 have the mark6 bezel

[hkbufga]

Originally Posted by swish77

Might be helpful to elaborate.

If I were seeking a true Patrizzi, I would buy only if I could confirm that the sub-dial patina occurred naturally, which is very difficult to do. I'd also much prefer a full set on this watch, preferably with U.S. paperwork that would specify that it originally came with a black dial.

That said, this example looks pretty good, with a case/bezel that has been polished, but doesn't look too bad. Is it worth $29K? Not to me, but that's a question each potential buyer would need to answer.

I acquired my 16520 U serial in 97 and has been done a professional complete overhaul (the case is still unpolished) in 2020. The subdials have been changed to humble creamy color gradually. Some oxidation on the dial that proves such patina of patrizzi and oxidation is happening at the same time. This may give you idea about what will be occured naturally and originally.

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[RC2]

Great watch

[RC2]

Great watch


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[scooba]

Originally Posted by swish77

Might be helpful to elaborate.

If I were seeking a true Patrizzi, I would buy only if I could confirm that the sub-dial patina occurred naturally, which is very difficult to do. I'd also much prefer a full set on this watch, preferably with U.S. paperwork that would specify that it originally came with a black dial.

That said, this example looks pretty good, with a case/bezel that has been polished, but doesn't look too bad. Is it worth $29K? Not to me, but that's a question each potential buyer would need to answer.

I have only ever seen one , I was queuing for a Apple product launch and the guy next too me was wearing a Daytona .I commented on nice watch ,he said it was but after two weeks holiday in South Africa and leaving the watch on a table the sun had changed the sub dial colour , He was pi££Ed this was about 10 yrs ago ,If he has left it alone I bet he is now 😍 , He thought it was caused by either heat or sun shine