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Old 22 October 2019, 12:18 AM   #121
locutus49
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Thanks. I know the term, not the acronym. Thanks. I was thinking it might be Made to Measure as in men's suits.

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Mark to market. A finance term. Paper profits/ or loss
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Old 22 October 2019, 12:27 AM   #122
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Thanks. I know the term, not the acronym. Thanks. I was thinking it might be Made to Measure as in men's suits.
Context, John, context! This is a financial discussion, not a sartorial one!

I'm waiting for a YTW (yield to worst) for describing a potential watch purchase.
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Old 22 October 2019, 12:32 AM   #123
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No one wears suits anymore buddy


Work gear
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Old 22 October 2019, 12:50 AM   #124
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No one wears suits anymore buddy


Work gear
I.T. guy?
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Old 22 October 2019, 12:52 AM   #125
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I.T. guy?
Lol nope
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Old 22 October 2019, 12:58 AM   #126
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No one wears suits anymore buddy


Work gear
Need to stop skipping leg day
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Old 22 October 2019, 01:00 AM   #127
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Need to stop skipping leg day
I just did it yesterday. It looks small cause I’m not on the juice
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Old 22 October 2019, 01:03 AM   #128
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I just did it yesterday. It looks small cause I’m not on the juice
Pork pies are what you want to be eating after training.
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Old 22 October 2019, 01:06 AM   #129
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Pork pies are what you want to be eating after training.
Will try that when I come visit... likely after brexit tho
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Old 22 October 2019, 01:35 AM   #130
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selling a dress watch is more work than selling a nautilus. My take is buy it only if you want to keep it. My vienna grey has a 5131r (!!!!))) sitting at 99k euros for more than a year, that is something like 80% above retail - normal for a nautilus. The 5131r is a super hyped watch but very hard to sell at that price.
I am being offered a 5131p (ad, at retail obviously), but i won't take it. Special application piece and all that, nevertheless it is kind of a dog imho, the 5231 is much nicer. I asked for a 5726a and they offered me the 5131p, think of that. It tells you something about the state of pp dress watches/special application pieces.
wow.
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Old 22 October 2019, 03:06 PM   #131
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No one wears suits anymore buddy


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And no one wear Reebok shoe now days..lol....

That is so 80s.......

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Old 23 October 2019, 06:36 PM   #132
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I have been on the waiting list for a 5711 with an AD for nearly 3 years. Called in for a chat about how things are progressing and I was told that if I buy any non-allocation PP watch, my chances of getting the 5711 within the next ~12 months would be excellent, compared to my current position of 'you're on the list, but big collectors/spenders take priority'. I have no purchase history with this AD, but we get on great and I am local. I tried on a lot of dress watches. Only a perpetual calendar (5140-P-017) really sang to me, but it is a lot more than I would like to spend on/have money in watches for the next few years at least. I also looked at a World Time on White Gold and annual calendars in rose. Nice pieces, but I am not keen to buy either these or the perpetual at full MSRP.

Hence I ask you guys, A) would you consider this? and B) If so, should I be asking for and getting good discount (how much?), even with the 'promise' of the 5711 (my grail). Thanks! Forgive me if I should have started a new thread here.
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Old 23 October 2019, 06:59 PM   #133
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you can buy the WT, see it at a loss and add that on to the price tag of the 5711. then you know whether it works for you or not.
or you sell the 5711 and get the WT almost for free:::)))
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Old 23 October 2019, 07:02 PM   #134
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I have been on the waiting list for a 5711 with an AD for nearly 3 years. Called in for a chat about how things are progressing and I was told that if I buy any non-allocation PP watch, my chances of getting the 5711 within the next ~12 months would be excellent, compared to my current position of 'you're on the list, but big collectors/spenders take priority'. I have no purchase history with this AD, but we get on great and I am local. I tried on a lot of dress watches. Only a perpetual calendar (5140-P-017) really sang to me, but it is a lot more than I would like to spend on/have money in watches for the next few years at least. I also looked at a World Time on White Gold and annual calendars in rose. Nice pieces, but I am not keen to buy either these or the perpetual at full MSRP.

Hence I ask you guys, A) would you consider this? and B) If so, should I be asking for and getting good discount (how much?), even with the 'promise' of the 5711 (my grail). Thanks! Forgive me if I should have started a new thread here.
Absolutely not. Tell them you are passionate about the 5711and will wait your turn in the queue. Also indicate that after you have the 5711 you will then be considering your next Patek and of course this will be purchased from them.
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Old 23 October 2019, 07:41 PM   #135
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Absolutely not. Tell them you are passionate about the 5711and will wait your turn in the queue. Also indicate that after you have the 5711 you will then be considering your next Patek and of course this will be purchased from them.
Great advice but IN REAL LIFE when will he get a 5711?

Here in the Us every AD basically says they cannot sell u a 5711 without prior purchase history...
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Old 23 October 2019, 07:46 PM   #136
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Great advice but IN REAL LIFE when will he get a 5711?

Here in the Us every AD basically says they cannot sell u a 5711 without prior purchase history...
Imagine 10 new customers walking into an AD without purchase history to enquire a 5711 each day, and over a month that's 300 5711. Supposed an AD receives 2 5711 per year, how long should he tell the customer who asks that question on the last day of the month?

"Sir, we will call you in 150 years' time."
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Old 23 October 2019, 07:54 PM   #137
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Imagine 10 new customers walking into an AD without purchase history to enquire a 5711 each day, and over a month that's 300 5711. Supposed an AD receives 2 5711 per year, how long should he tell the customer who asks that question on the last day of the month?

"Sir, we will call you in 150 years' time."
Like I said great advice...
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Old 23 October 2019, 08:01 PM   #138
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Really appreciate your insights - thanks. I did get on the 'list' 3 years ago (which closed officially a month later), before everything got as crazy as it is now. I actually wanted to buy what I liked - a 5711. Hence I don't think I would be waiting 150 years! But I do take your point it could be a longer wait than most people want. Russell, on principle I may take your advice, as £38K or more on a watch that is a gateway purchase is a bit much. I was also thinking if the market drops significantly, through global downturn, we might see wait lists shrink a bit. PS If I did get a 5711 I can't see me ever selling it, even for a large profit.
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Old 23 October 2019, 08:03 PM   #139
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Great advice but IN REAL LIFE when will he get a 5711?

Here in the Us every AD basically says they cannot sell u a 5711 without prior purchase history...
They might say that but it is down to the AD to submit your name to Rhone and new clients are accepted. The wait can be long but eventually the order will be filled and we are already 3 years into this wait. The market is also changing, grey prices are dropping and at some point the demand will be at least partially satisfied.

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Imagine 10 new customers walking into an AD without purchase history to enquire a 5711 each day, and over a month that's 300 5711. Supposed an AD receives 2 5711 per year, how long should he tell the customer who asks that question on the last day of the month?

"Sir, we will call you in 150 years' time."
Remember he is in the UK, Rhone controls UK distribution so the goal is to get accepted by Rhone and from there onwards all is good. Rhone will check if you are submitting multiple AD requests. AD has already accepted the order, this is not a cold call situation.
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Old 23 October 2019, 08:03 PM   #140
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I’ll give u alternative advice... wait for the prices to drop and buy it from a grey dealer. Buying it from a AD only if you plan on buying a lot more watches... it’s a commitment. If u can buy it from a multi brand AD.


The mark-up is just the price of access, u would lose that much investing in the relationship unless u love dress watches.. cause they are so cool.
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Old 23 October 2019, 08:05 PM   #141
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Really appreciate your insights - thanks. I did get on the 'list' 3 years ago (which closed officially a month later), before everything got as crazy as it is now. I actually wanted to buy what I liked - a 5711. Hence I don't think I would be waiting 150 years! But I do take your point it could be a longer wait than most people want. Russel, on principle I may take your advice, as £38K or more on a watch that is a gateway purchase is a bit much. I was also thinking if the market drops significantly, through global downturn, we might see wait lists shrink a bit. PS If I did get a 5711 I can't see me ever selling it, even for a large profit.
Good luck, as you can see I would wait it out. It is worth the wait.

Hopefully this won't depress you but as many on the forum know I waited 8 years for my first PP.
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Old 23 October 2019, 08:06 PM   #142
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Good luck, as you can see I would wait it out. It is worth the wait.

Hopefully this won't depress you but as many on the forum know I waited 8 years for my first PP.
I didn’t but I’m just going to say wow

Good for u bro
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Old 23 October 2019, 08:08 PM   #143
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I’ll give u alternative advice... wait for the prices to drop and buy it from a grey dealer. Buying it from a AD only if you plan on buying a lot more watches... it’s a commitment. If u can buy it from a multi brand AD.
Multi-brand and diamonds.

My 2 ADs don't sell diamonds so we buy diamonds from a random jeweller instead of being put towards my purchase history at my AD.



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Old 23 October 2019, 09:00 PM   #144
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I guess I am lucky because I think dress watches, like my recent purchase of a 5205G-013, are absolutely gorgeous and to me are almost as desirable as the 5711. I did ask them to put me on a “5711 list,” whatever that means, and content to wait. The anticipation makes the reward all that much better. If grey prices get close to parity then simple to pull the ripcord and jump to grey. My preference is AD however.
Btw...what really is the “list?” An official document sent to Patek, or a napkin in a drawer at the AD?
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Old 23 October 2019, 09:03 PM   #145
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Remember he is in the UK, Rhone controls UK distribution so the goal is to get accepted by Rhone and from there onwards all is good. Rhone will check if you are submitting multiple AD requests. AD has already accepted the order, this is not a cold call situation.
Rhone's approach is quite similar to Liberta's then, as they allow new applicants to receive the watch, albeit over a longer time horizon.

Over here at SEA, the Patek agent (GMT) gives the AD full discretion to allocate their watches. It is very unlikely for new applicants to receive hot watches without any history.
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Old 23 October 2019, 09:27 PM   #146
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Good luck, as you can see I would wait it out. It is worth the wait.

Hopefully this won't depress you but as many on the forum know I waited 8 years for my first PP.
congrats on your stamina. i waited three months on my first nauti from my AD some two years back and thought that was long.
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Old 23 October 2019, 09:28 PM   #147
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Rhone's approach is quite similar to Liberta's then, as they allow new applicants to receive the watch, albeit over a longer time horizon.

Over here at SEA, the Patek agent (GMT) gives the AD full discretion to allocate their watches. It is very unlikely for new applicants to receive hot watches without any history.
I thought Liberta needed business cards
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Old 23 October 2019, 09:28 PM   #148
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I was never interested in the Nautilus.
I bought a 5170, a 5205, a 5270, and only then casually asked about their "cheapest" Nautilus the 5711. Given that was "only" £18k at the time and not much more than a RG Daytona, I said, "sure, if you have one, I'll take it."

It came about a year later by which time I'd bought a 5146 as well. I'd forgotten about it. That's probably why I got one. The AD knows me and knows that I couldn't care less about the hype/flipping etc.

That's the thing, I believe PP is actually, truly, really about their dress watches. That's where their skills really come to life and I find it surprising how people can get into their sports watches but not get into PP's true calling.

Sports watches, by being big and brash, lend themselves better to status signalling - especially amongst the un-initated. In the Instaloser/Facebrat world we live in, that's what people want. A 5327 PC is far too subtle.

I find it AMAZING that people would rather have a 5711 than a 5070. My mind boggles. Sign of the times.
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Old 23 October 2019, 09:30 PM   #149
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It’s that age old debate of changing trends ... people are less formal. When Goldman Sachs shifts from suit and tie to a business casual policy. U know dress watches are marked for death.


Case in point I wear shorts to work...no I’m not an IT guy
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Old 23 October 2019, 09:30 PM   #150
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Imagine 10 new customers walking into an AD without purchase history to enquire a 5711 each day, and over a month that's 300 5711. Supposed an AD receives 2 5711 per year, how long should he tell the customer who asks that question on the last day of the month?
This is ABSOLUTELY correct.
It's what so many dealers actually report.
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