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timelord · 19 August 2011, 11:14 PM

OK, after a few days, I finally get my diagnosis on why the helium escape valve was leaking in the thread that I posted yesterday http://rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=190356.
I went to see my qualified Rolex master and the news was not good

He showed me that the problem is inside the case where hole of the case butts against the valve. He showed me that there was a small pit caused by some crevice corrosion possibly caused by halide salts or any possible oxidants creeping through with moisture. The worst news is that he mentioned from his experience that these pits in stainless steel continue to grow and cannot be stopped so he did recommend that I should not put it in water

as it will never really be waterproof. Sorry that I do not have any pictures to show as I did not expect this and he has the watch. He did say that it is one of the design faults that it should have had a separate crown like the winding crown as some seikos? do. I have always rinsed and serviced my watch and was surprised by the fact that it wasn't enough until I saw the corrosion tables in http://www.outokumpu.com/application.../corrstart.asp and how vulnerable different stainless steel grades can be. Anyway, thanks for reading

Johny · 20 August 2011, 01:02 AM

sorry to hear that. perhaps contact the rsc at st james and ask about a new case.

zeuloa · 20 August 2011, 01:46 AM

Are these failures with the HEV a common failure?

padi56 · 20 August 2011, 01:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeuloa

Are these failures with the HEV a common failure?

Well in over 30 years of being around Rolex watches this is the first incident I have ever heard of.The HEV is only needed when breathing gas like helium enters the watch when a saturation diver is decompressing in a dry chamber.The HEV allows to expanded pressurised breathing gas to escape via the one way out HEV as the diver reaches normal on surface atmospheric pressure .

Tools · 20 August 2011, 02:06 AM

Your issue is not a well known problem with the Sea Dweller.. I would drop by the RSC and see if they can address the issue. It's possible that they have a fix such as a slightly larger valve where the hole can be re-tapped and fitted.. (a new middle case is definitely a fix, but an expensive one)

It's no good to have a Sea Dweller that can't dwell in the seas..

I do know that the case can be laser welded at the defect and the hole re-tapped for the valve, but you need a restoration specialist for the job..

Johny · 20 August 2011, 02:51 AM

does anyone have a drawing or pics of this area on a sea dweller? thank you

HongNinja · 20 August 2011, 03:54 AM

Dang. I've never heard of such a thing one a ROLEX SEA-DWELLER.... Yikes. Makes me scared for my precious SD now. No bueno.

le_baroudeur · 20 August 2011, 05:50 AM

You are the only one with such a problem.. 904l is NOT supposed to rust, much less than 316L which can hardly rust! You should contact your country rolex center, and try to get a new service case, perhaps they will do that for free, the steel may have a defect...

zeuloa · 20 August 2011, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by le_baroudeur

You are the only one with such a problem.. 904l is NOT supposed to rust, much less than 316L which can hardly rust! You should contact your country rolex center, and try to get a new service case, perhaps they will do that for free, the steel may have a defect...

Agree 100%

Dweller of the Sea · 20 August 2011, 06:52 AM

Never heard of a problem with the HEV.

Is it a new watch?
The HEV has gaskets, and if it is an older watch that hasn´t been proper serviced, then it can be a bad gasket that has caused the problem.

SALTY · 20 August 2011, 07:23 AM

If Rolex does not stand up and make this immediately right it would be a disgrace.

I have no use for a HEV but this is even more severe than putting a hole in an otherise solid case.

I believe that winds blow, fires burn, crops fail and $hit happens but ... Rolex had better make this good!

sleddog · 20 August 2011, 08:53 AM

Not a good diagnosis.....
I would bet there was an imperfection in the SS itself before it was machined out to make the midcase..Perhaps a small pocket of pitted material!!

I'm sorry to hear this, but I think what Larry said above is the best option.
Take it to RSC and ask for an opinion on the metals integrity..Who knows, maybe they'll replace it as a defect even if outside the warranty period.
We have another member here that had his midcase replaced on a 16610 because of a discoloration in the metals finish...

Best of luck and let us know how it goes!

timelord · 20 August 2011, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dweller of the Sea

Never heard of a problem with the HEV.

Is it a new watch?
.

but was only 5 months old with the papers dating to March 2003. As I was not the original owner I had it serviced just after the warranty expired to make sure that it was like as if I had bought it new. No mention of such a problem then but I did not really do any deep swimming or diving to check it out.

greekbum · 20 August 2011, 09:17 AM

I would take the watch to Rolex. They will not give you an explanation or excuses they will fix it 100%. Out of curiosity can your Rolex watchmaker get HEV parts and gaskets? He may have a parts account but in certain countries they do not sell those specific parts to them as they do not have the equipment to pressure test them properly to specs. Does he have the right equipment to pressure test that specific watch? Something to think about.

zeuloa · 20 August 2011, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timelord

but was only 5 months old with the papers dating to March 2003. As I was not the original owner I had it serviced just after the warranty expired to make sure that it was like as if I had bought it new. No mention of such a problem then but I did not really do any deep swimming or diving to check it out.

Was it serviced by a Rolex Service Center?

timelord · 20 August 2011, 09:25 AM

[QUOTE=le_baroudeur;2683508] 904l is NOT supposed to rust, much less than 316L which can hardly rust!QUOTE]

Something as simple as moist Iodine can be a threat. You could be putting some on your cut close to where you wear the watch and that is already a small chance. Check out the following site that specialises in SS
[url]http://www.outokumpu.com/applications/corrosion/view_details.asp?name=IO01

Jason71 · 20 August 2011, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greekbum

I would take the watch to Rolex. They will not give you an explanation or excuses they will fix it 100%. Out of curiosity can your Rolex watchmaker get HEV parts and gaskets? He may have a parts account but in certain countries they do not sell those specific parts to them as they do not have the equipment to pressure test them properly to specs. Does he have the right equipment to pressure test that specific watch? Something to think about.

I agree. Something doesn't smell quite right. Send it to RSC.

landroverking · 20 August 2011, 09:44 AM

All I can say is what? Been wearing Rolex since 1978 & never had any case problems.

Dweller of the Sea · 20 August 2011, 10:11 PM

Rolex Service Centers always change the HEV during a service.
Independent watchmakers seldom change them, because they can not always get the HEV sparepart, because of lacking the 1200m pressure test kit.

If it was serviced by an independent, then its probably a bad gasket. These need to replaced, just like the others. If it is from 2003, then it is also an old gasket.

Take it to a RSC, they are the experts on this model.

I have had three SD 16600, and one now, and never had any problems.

timelord · 21 August 2011, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeuloa

Was it serviced by a Rolex Service Center?

That was back in 2005. I do remember that they sold new models and that they had to send it away for some 4-6 weeks. I wasn't as savvy about this watch business as I am now from what I learnt from this forum. Great forum with nice supportive and non arrogant members, unlike what I experienced on another previous forum that I belonged to

Quote:

Originally Posted by greekbum

I would take the watch to Rolex. They will not give you an explanation or excuses they will fix it 100%. Out of curiosity can your Rolex watchmaker get HEV parts and gaskets? He may have a parts account but in certain countries they do not sell those specific parts to them as they do not have the equipment to pressure test them properly to specs. Does he have the right equipment to pressure test that specific watch? Something to think about.

I believe he does have a parts account as he replaced a rotor axle where the automatic winder moves, as other watchmakers were unable to get this spare. However the pit inside where the valve butts against the hole was very significant and it was already bubbling when I had my wrist in shallow water, so right equipment or not, I guess that it doesn't matter. I will just wear it and keep it away from water treating it as an ordinary watch. However, I will also contact Rolex directly-

RRsDJ · 23 October 2012, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timelord

However, I will also contact Rolex directly-

I know its a little over a year later but any update?

Rashid.bk · 23 October 2012, 12:05 PM

as a SD owner and possible DSSD.... yeah, real curious about an update.

beetleything · 23 October 2012, 01:25 PM

I wonder if you could just seal it off - so it did not work either way.
Obviously that would mean you could not go deep with it but still in the water.

Interesting stuff.
I would think it quite a rare occurence (one would hope so).

Please update us on what happens to your watch.
Good luck.

sdwtchlvr · 23 October 2012, 01:54 PM

+1

Quote:

Originally Posted by tools

your issue is not a well known problem with the sea dweller.. I would drop by the rsc and see if they can address the issue. It's possible that they have a fix such as a slightly larger valve where the hole can be re-tapped and fitted.. (a new middle case is definitely a fix, but an expensive one)

it's no good to have a sea dweller that can't dwell in the seas..

I do know that the case can be laser welded at the defect and the hole re-tapped for the valve, but you need a restoration specialist for the job..

GradyPhilpott · 23 October 2012, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timelord

He showed me that there was a small pit caused by some crevice corrosion possibly caused by halide salts or any possible oxidants creeping through with moisture.[emphasis mine]

This is the part that makes no sense to me based on my understanding of the HEV.

The valve only opens when the the watch should be dry and it is designed to be impervious to water molecules.

I'm really looking forward to reading the outcome of this.

timelord · 24 October 2012, 11:42 PM

I have made an update on the new thread http://rolexforums.com/showthread.ph...69#post3673769

19 August 2011, 11:14 PM	#1
timelord "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Margate Watch: your back Posts: 324	diagnosis on Sea Dweller helium escape valve OK, after a few days, I finally get my diagnosis on why the helium escape valve was leaking in the thread that I posted yesterday http://rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=190356. I went to see my qualified Rolex master and the news was not good He showed me that the problem is inside the case where hole of the case butts against the valve. He showed me that there was a small pit caused by some crevice corrosion possibly caused by halide salts or any possible oxidants creeping through with moisture. The worst news is that he mentioned from his experience that these pits in stainless steel continue to grow and cannot be stopped so he did recommend that I should not put it in water as it will never really be waterproof. Sorry that I do not have any pictures to show as I did not expect this and he has the watch. He did say that it is one of the design faults that it should have had a separate crown like the winding crown as some seikos? do. I have always rinsed and serviced my watch and was surprised by the fact that it wasn't enough until I saw the corrosion tables in http://www.outokumpu.com/application.../corrstart.asp and how vulnerable different stainless steel grades can be. Anyway, thanks for reading

20 August 2011, 01:02 AM	#2
Johny "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Real Name: john Location: Scotland Watch: sub 16610Lv Posts: 13,523	sorry to hear that. perhaps contact the rsc at st james and ask about a new case. __________________ "AFTER DARK" BAR AND NIGHT CLUB GM.

20 August 2011, 02:06 AM	#5
Tools TRF Moderator & 2024 DATE-JUST41 Patron Join Date: May 2007 Real Name: Larry Location: Mojave Desert Watch: GMT's Posts: 43,037	Your issue is not a well known problem with the Sea Dweller.. I would drop by the RSC and see if they can address the issue. It's possible that they have a fix such as a slightly larger valve where the hole can be re-tapped and fitted.. (a new middle case is definitely a fix, but an expensive one) It's no good to have a Sea Dweller that can't dwell in the seas.. I do know that the case can be laser welded at the defect and the hole re-tapped for the valve, but you need a restoration specialist for the job.. __________________ (Chill ... It's just a watch Forum.....) NAWCC Member

20 August 2011, 02:51 AM	#6
Johny "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Real Name: john Location: Scotland Watch: sub 16610Lv Posts: 13,523	does anyone have a drawing or pics of this area on a sea dweller? thank you __________________ "AFTER DARK" BAR AND NIGHT CLUB GM.

20 August 2011, 05:50 AM	#8
le_baroudeur "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Rennes, FRANCE Posts: 802	You are the only one with such a problem.. 904l is NOT supposed to rust, much less than 316L which can hardly rust! You should contact your country rolex center, and try to get a new service case, perhaps they will do that for free, the steel may have a defect... __________________ Card Carrying Member of the Global Assoc. of Retro-Grouch-Curmudgeons.

20 August 2011, 01:46 AM	#3
zeuloa "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Real Name: Jose Location: Here Watch: SEA-DWELLER Posts: 2,232	Are these failures with the HEV a common failure?

20 August 2011, 03:54 AM	#7
HongNinja Banned Join Date: May 2011 Location: On Earth Watch: 228238, 114060 Posts: 1,347	Dang. I've never heard of such a thing one a ROLEX SEA-DWELLER.... Yikes. Makes me scared for my precious SD now. No bueno.

20 August 2011, 06:52 AM	#10
Dweller of the Sea "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: EU Watch: ing TRF Posts: 576	Never heard of a problem with the HEV. Is it a new watch? The HEV has gaskets, and if it is an older watch that hasn´t been proper serviced, then it can be a bad gasket that has caused the problem.

20 August 2011, 07:23 AM	#11
SALTY "TRF" Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: USA Watch: Your Six Posts: 1,499	If Rolex does not stand up and make this immediately right it would be a disgrace. I have no use for a HEV but this is even more severe than putting a hole in an otherise solid case. I believe that winds blow, fires burn, crops fail and $hit happens but ... Rolex had better make this good!

20 August 2011, 08:53 AM	#12
sleddog TRF Moderator & 2024 DATE-JUST41 Patron Join Date: Jul 2007 Real Name: Rob Location: Nearby. Posts: 24,903	Not a good diagnosis..... I would bet there was an imperfection in the SS itself before it was machined out to make the midcase..Perhaps a small pocket of pitted material!! I'm sorry to hear this, but I think what Larry said above is the best option. Take it to RSC and ask for an opinion on the metals integrity..Who knows, maybe they'll replace it as a defect even if outside the warranty period. We have another member here that had his midcase replaced on a 16610 because of a discoloration in the metals finish... Best of luck and let us know how it goes! __________________ He who wears a Rolex is always on time, even when late!! TRF's "After Dark" Bar & Nightclub Patron-Founding Member..

20 August 2011, 09:17 AM	#14
greekbum "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Real Name: Nikos Location: Florida Watch: Rolex GMT 16750 Posts: 8,415	I would take the watch to Rolex. They will not give you an explanation or excuses they will fix it 100%. Out of curiosity can your Rolex watchmaker get HEV parts and gaskets? He may have a parts account but in certain countries they do not sell those specific parts to them as they do not have the equipment to pressure test them properly to specs. Does he have the right equipment to pressure test that specific watch? Something to think about. __________________ Follow Me On Instagram @nickgogas Original Owner ROLEX 16750 GMT Daily Wearer For Over 13,000 Days And Counting

20 August 2011, 09:25 AM	#16
timelord "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Margate Watch: your back Posts: 324	Really!!! [QUOTE=le_baroudeur;2683508] 904l is NOT supposed to rust, much less than 316L which can hardly rust!QUOTE] Something as simple as moist Iodine can be a threat. You could be putting some on your cut close to where you wear the watch and that is already a small chance. Check out the following site that specialises in SS [url]http://www.outokumpu.com/applications/corrosion/view_details.asp?name=IO01

20 August 2011, 09:44 AM	#18
landroverking "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Real Name: Jay Location: TEXAS Watch: Daytona Posts: 7,648	All I can say is what? Been wearing Rolex since 1978 & never had any case problems.

20 August 2011, 10:11 PM	#19
Dweller of the Sea "TRF" Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: EU Watch: ing TRF Posts: 576	Rolex Service Centers always change the HEV during a service. Independent watchmakers seldom change them, because they can not always get the HEV sparepart, because of lacking the 1200m pressure test kit. If it was serviced by an independent, then its probably a bad gasket. These need to replaced, just like the others. If it is from 2003, then it is also an old gasket. Take it to a RSC, they are the experts on this model. I have had three SD 16600, and one now, and never had any problems.

23 October 2012, 12:05 PM	#22
Rashid.bk "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Dallas Watch: 12800ft = 3900m Posts: 11,172	as a SD owner and possible DSSD.... yeah, real curious about an update.

23 October 2012, 01:25 PM	#23
beetleything "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Real Name: Big Al Location: Canada Watch: the next one Posts: 153	I wonder if you could just seal it off - so it did not work either way. Obviously that would mean you could not go deep with it but still in the water. Interesting stuff. I would think it quite a rare occurence (one would hope so). Please update us on what happens to your watch. Good luck.

24 October 2012, 11:42 PM	#26
timelord "TRF" Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Margate Watch: your back Posts: 324	I have made an update on the new thread http://rolexforums.com/showthread.ph...69#post3673769

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