How determine the original bezel on a GMT or GMT II

[Actor07]

Questions: I understand that changing the aluminum bezels on the GMTs are not that difficult. How can you tell if the original bezel has been changed (i.e. changing a non-Pepsi bezel for a Pepsi bezel)? Also, can you change a Ceramic bezel? Finally, does changing from the original bezel color to a different color decrease the value of the GMT? I want to buy an original Pepsi GMT or GMT II Ceramic or aluminum bezel.

Thanks

[mrlube1151001]

If you have the hang white tags that might show.

[Tools]

I'm sure that you just mean the insert; it is impossible to know on the aluminum models unless you have original paperwork with the build code. Some research would be needed to know if the insert is period correct and so has a good chance to be original to the watch.

It is important to know that the GMT Master never came in black/red.

As to ceramics, the insert is not changeable without proper tools and serious skills.

[Gearjockey]

I’m new to this reference and looking at one myself.
I’m guessing here, but it seems like a ceramic bezel would be cost prohibitive to change and I’ve never heard of it but I suppose it’s possible. I’m sure the ceramic bezels crack in some instances, and then a replacement would be necessary, so yes it’s possible.

I understand that many people view Pepsi>Coke>black, but my thought is to buy a black 16710, full set and maybe one additional bezel insert. The price is the price but I don’t see it’s value lagging behind It’s allegedly superior cousins.

[Actor07]

Thanks @gearjockey @tools and @mrlube1151001 for your advice. Much appreciated.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by Actor07

Questions: I understand that changing the aluminum bezels on the GMTs are not that difficult. How can you tell if the original bezel has been changed (i.e. changing a non-Pepsi bezel for a Pepsi bezel)? Also, can you change a Ceramic bezel? Finally, does changing from the original bezel color to a different color decrease the value of the GMT? I want to buy an original Pepsi GMT or GMT II Ceramic or aluminum bezel.

Thanks

Well on say the 16710 range the bezels were made to be DIY changeable so does not really matter you could get all 3 inserts it's a very versatile watch.But on the ceramic versions they are not easy to change and Rolex would only change to the one that came with that reference watch.

[worldofoyster]

Originally Posted by mrlube1151001

If you have the hang white tags that might show.

that's why the white tag is important, and it's not a full set without the white tag

[alcaliguri]

Determining if the original bezel has been changed on a GMT watch can be challenging but look for signs of wear or inconsistencies in color and finish. Changing a ceramic bezel is more complex and usually requires professional intervention. As for the impact on value, altering the original bezel color might affect collector desirability and resale value, but it varies case by case. It's generally recommended to seek original models or consult with experts for informed decisions on purchasing.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by worldofoyster

that's why the white tag is important, and it's not a full set without the white tag

Amen! Remember that crazy thread?

Kat


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[kegan]

Can’t help you for every one out there but if you find an A serial with a black/red insert this is the original insert and paperwork for a watch purchased new April 2000


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[painexpert]

After the model number on your papers will be an A or a B. A is a coke bezel insert and B is a pepsi. For example; you have a 16710A or 16710B. My 2007 M serial GMT II is 16710A. Its a coke. If there are no papers or card I dont believe that you can tell unless this info is on the white tag. If you have no paperwork, etc. you will not be able to know.

[watchmavan]

Originally Posted by Tools

I'm sure that you just mean the insert; it is impossible to know on the aluminum models unless you have original paperwork with the build code. Some research would be needed to know if the insert is period correct and so has a good chance to be original to the watch.

It is important to know that the GMT Master never came in black/red.

As to ceramics, the insert is not changeable without proper tools and serious skills.

Ceramics can be changed quite easily actually. Easier than aluminium as well as they won’t scratch.


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[padi56]

Originally Posted by painexpert

After the model number on your papers will be an A or a B. A is a coke bezel insert and B is a pepsi. For example; you have a 16710A or 16710B. My 2007 M serial GMT II is 16710A. Its a coke. If there are no papers or card I dont believe that you can tell unless this info is on the white tag. If you have no paperwork, etc. you will not be able to know.

Not in all parts of the world with say the 16710 range many countries had nothing to indicate bezel colour, but it was mostly in the USA this happened. As Rolex USA was a separate company from say the company Rolex Europe rest of the world, and again Rolex did not start selling in the USA till the 1940s.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by watchmavan

Ceramics can be changed quite easily actually. Easier than aluminium as well as they won’t scratch.


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Well all my experience and information this is not true, yes they can be changed but can assure not as easy as the aluminium, as they can easily be broken and scratch and far greater expense to replace.

[Harry-57]

Are we absolutely certain that the original white tag for this model indicates which insert was fitted in the factory? Anybody got one?

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by watchmavan

Ceramics can be changed quite easily actually.

If you have the equipment for ceramic inserts, have been trained and it's the correct press for the particular insert. The BLRO press is different.

If the OEM equipment is not required please share.

[Gaijin]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

Are we absolutely certain that the original white tag for this model indicates which insert was fitted in the factory? Anybody got one?

Yes. I have the tag on my Pepsi. It was born a Black bezel. It says 16710LN.

[WatchSmith]

Originally Posted by watchmavan

Ceramics can be changed quite easily actually. Easier than aluminium as well as they won’t scratch.


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This is definitely not the case.

Ceramic bezels are high risk and require special dies for removal and installation, and the ceramic pepsi insert has a hytrel ring around its parameter that other GMT ceramic inserts do not have. I believe the ceramic pepsi version also uses a unique bezel ring that is different than the other ceramic GMTs, likely to accommodate the hytrel ring.