Should I go for a 3940?

[rolexlun]

Hi everyone!

I have been thinking about getting a 3940 (Can be a J/R/G depending on price and condition) to add into my collection. This will be my first vintage/pre-owned watch as I have always preferred brand new watches. I haven't had a chance to try one yet locally but I just love the look of it, the case size, the thinness, the dial layout etc. I recently let go of a 5196R due to the fact that it wears relatively large for a 37mm dress watch and I am assuming 3940 wears and feels much smaller.

To fund this 3940, I will either have to wait for 2-3 more years at least to save up or I will have to let go of my 5167a or other watches in my collection. What should I do?

My current collection:
5167a, 5712/1a, 15202ST, 116520 (black), ALS One (WG), Tudor BB58, couple of other Cartiers and a Panerai.

Much appreciated for you guys' opinion on this. Thank you.

[erics]

3940 is fabulous. I have toyed with it for 5 years and prices firmed up. It's the essence of PP imv at a very affordable price (relatively).

Start by selling Panerai, Cartiers, Tudor and even ALS if needed. My opinion is that 3940 > 5167a, much more interesting. If funds aren't sufficient.

For whatever reason i think a 3940 has to be J or R, the white metals are a bit too sterile and cold for my taste.

[ts3]

The 3940 wears smaller than 5196. The busy dial and the bezel shape make it look small for its size and it is smaller on paper than 5196 anyway. A former colleague wore a 3940P every day and it didn't look much larger than my simple 34mm 3998P (which I got when I found 5196 large for my 6.6 inch wrists).

While I like the 3940 quite a lot I have not pulled the trigger myself as I always tend to gravitate back to simpler watches. Letting your 5167 go wouldn't be hard for me though as I prefer the 5711 and 12 and you have got the latter.

[2nastie]

3940 is one of the top PP references in the modern era. Definitely worth acquiring if you find a nice model. In my books I would let go some of your other watches and keep the 5167. However, with the 5167 values at this stage... correct me if I'm wrong it's almost a straight trade or even benefit for you? Watch vs. watch, 3940 hands down.

[N_Architect]

A number of solid references in ss, namely the Aquanaut, the Nautilus, the RO and of course the Daytona. All nice choices.

A ppc ref in pm is a potential natural step up. The subject PP should wear really nice. I would also agree to acquire it in the J variant, preferably.

I had a 41mm RO chrono, the 5712, a 5196J, an ALS Dato and the Daytona (the Rolex in two tone but also in full RG). Plus a couple of PAMs and a Cartier, among others. This is just to show you where I'm coming from.

Would strongly caution against parting with your Lange 1, which I can only assume is not the Grand and hopefully is the slightly improved latest version (post-2014 if not mistaken). Either way, this is a very classic and quite understated piece which wears exceptionally well on any wrist. In this particular setup therefore, you did well parting with your 5196 (my own and subjective opinion of course) and kept the L1. The 37mm 5196 is not that large but does wear relatively large due to its shallow thickness.

Next up, let's take a closer look at all those ss sports references you have. The 5712 is a tremendously well balanced reference, in almost all aspects (quality of finish, complications, water resistance, unobtrusiveness, movement/timekeeping, feel and wear on the wrist, etc.) So especially that one should preferably stay.

Re the Aquanaut or the Daytona I cannot say. You know better. It's good to have at least one chrono in the collection, but then again the 5167 is terrific for those summer months... The RO is a jewel on the wrist, and certainly an investment from a monetary point of view. Again, only you can make a call here. Very special, highly sought after pieces all of these, and I will just add a caution perhaps for the obvious and apparent lack of need for you to add any other sports ss ref here.

Re the Cartiers and PAMs, agree w/ the OP who suggested to perhaps trim the collection here. Unless you do have a sentimental reason not to part with at least some of these, of course.

Other refs you could go out and at least try in the pre-owned market would be the regulator PP in white gold (now discontinued, ref. 5235G), a PP world timer/chrono (5930G) although this wears not so large it is a stretch budget-wise, or even perhaps the mighty 5230G which may not be a ppc but it so nice in real life... A good condition 5130G is also a good choice. Give them a try, if you have not done so yet, you're in a market where these are plentiful pre-owned anyhow. I do understand however that a ppc acquisition is your main desire, rightfully so.

The sports ss refs you possess are in an excellent state. Try to patiently and carefully add a couple of complicated pieces in pm, just like the ppc you now have in mind, without making huge sacrifices in the excellent balance of sports pieces you now have.

[AHG]

I'm biased but like you I find the modern time-only watches to be too large and "empty" on a small wrist. Also, the 3940 is one of my grails. I had been eyeing it precovid where many great examples were available at a "bargain" price. I didn't pull the trigger and have since regretted it. Finally, I bought a Series 3 3940J this week and I'm waiting for it to be sorted out. It's from a reputable source, but obviously more expensive than a few years back. Also the case has a fair amount of scratches and a few dings, and I've chosen not to have it polished at least for now. A lot of 3940's I've seen online look nice because of too much polishing. I look forward to sharing pictures upon arrival.

[jon_jon]

With the 3940, you are purchasing a Patek perpetual calendar, a well respected complication that Patek patented a hundred years ago. Patek produced the 3940 for ~ 20 years, so there are a lot of 3940J's out there and less R and G, because J was still the most popular metal for dress watches back in the late 20th century and into the early 21st century. With pricing they have been creeping up over the past few years. However they are still a great buy when you compare pricing to the current Patek PC 5327, the younger and large sibling to the 3940.

[Nicof]

The 3940 is the favorite watch I own. I find it perfect in terms of shape and size. Just looks great on the wrist. As others of said it is really is good value for money. I doubt you would regret getting one.


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[rolexlun]

Originally Posted by erics

3940 is fabulous. I have toyed with it for 5 years and prices firmed up. It's the essence of PP imv at a very affordable price (relatively).

Start by selling Panerai, Cartiers, Tudor and even ALS if needed. My opinion is that 3940 > 5167a, much more interesting. If funds aren't sufficient.

For whatever reason i think a 3940 has to be J or R, the white metals are a bit too sterile and cold for my taste.

I have only started looking at 3940 more a less a year ago and I have seen a gradual upward trend on its price but that's probably aligned with the general watch market. I have always thought this is a hidden gem in terms of the value. I am worried that if I don't get it now, I might not be able to get it in a few years time when this watch may not be affordable anymore (relatively). At the sometime, I do not want to let go of my 5167 just yet at the moment....

[rolexlun]

Originally Posted by ts3

The 3940 wears smaller than 5196. The busy dial and the bezel shape make it look small for its size and it is smaller on paper than 5196 anyway. A former colleague wore a 3940P every day and it didn't look much larger than my simple 34mm 3998P (which I got when I found 5196 large for my 6.6 inch wrists).

While I like the 3940 quite a lot I have not pulled the trigger myself as I always tend to gravitate back to simpler watches. Letting your 5167 go wouldn't be hard for me though as I prefer the 5711 and 12 and you have got the latter.

Thanks for the sizing reference. The fact that it doesn't look much larger than your 3998P further reassures me that the size is perfect. Need to get one to try on first though.

It's a bit of a pity that the 5196 doesn't really fit my wrist, its a beautiful watch.

[rolexlun]

Originally Posted by 2nastie

3940 is one of the top PP references in the modern era. Definitely worth acquiring if you find a nice model. In my books I would let go some of your other watches and keep the 5167. However, with the 5167 values at this stage... correct me if I'm wrong it's almost a straight trade or even benefit for you? Watch vs. watch, 3940 hands down.

It's crazy actually. Based on C24, I think 3940 is half the price of a 5167....

[rolexlun]

Originally Posted by N_Architect

A number of solid references in ss, namely the Aquanaut, the Nautilus, the RO and of course the Daytona. All nice choices.

A ppc ref in pm is a potential natural step up. The subject PP should wear really nice. I would also agree to acquire it in the J variant, preferably.

I had a 41mm RO chrono, the 5712, a 5196J, an ALS Dato and the Daytona (the Rolex in two tone but also in full RG). Plus a couple of PAMs and a Cartier, among others. This is just to show you where I'm coming from.

Would strongly caution against parting with your Lange 1, which I can only assume is not the Grand and hopefully is the slightly improved latest version (post-2014 if not mistaken). Either way, this is a very classic and quite understated piece which wears exceptionally well on any wrist. In this particular setup therefore, you did well parting with your 5196 (my own and subjective opinion of course) and kept the L1. The 37mm 5196 is not that large but does wear relatively large due to its shallow thickness.

Next up, let's take a closer look at all those ss sports references you have. The 5712 is a tremendously well balanced reference, in almost all aspects (quality of finish, complications, water resistance, unobtrusiveness, movement/timekeeping, feel and wear on the wrist, etc.) So especially that one should preferably stay.

Re the Aquanaut or the Daytona I cannot say. You know better. It's good to have at least one chrono in the collection, but then again the 5167 is terrific for those summer months... The RO is a jewel on the wrist, and certainly an investment from a monetary point of view. Again, only you can make a call here. Very special, highly sought after pieces all of these, and I will just add a caution perhaps for the obvious and apparent lack of need for you to add any other sports ss ref here.

Re the Cartiers and PAMs, agree w/ the OP who suggested to perhaps trim the collection here. Unless you do have a sentimental reason not to part with at least some of these, of course.

Other refs you could go out and at least try in the pre-owned market would be the regulator PP in white gold (now discontinued, ref. 5235G), a PP world timer/chrono (5930G) although this wears not so large it is a stretch budget-wise, or even perhaps the mighty 5230G which may not be a ppc but it so nice in real life... A good condition 5130G is also a good choice. Give them a try, if you have not done so yet, you're in a market where these are plentiful pre-owned anyhow. I do understand however that a ppc acquisition is your main desire, rightfully so.

The sports ss refs you possess are in an excellent state. Try to patiently and carefully add a couple of complicated pieces in pm, just like the ppc you now have in mind, without making huge sacrifices in the excellent balance of sports pieces you now have.

Really appreciate on your detailed analysis on my collection. It looks like we have similar taste in watches and I think you have therefore sum it up perfectly. The 5712 and 15202 are my favourites. The Lange one is not the grand one and is indeed post 2014 version, its beautiful and it still gives me a smile every time I put it on. It probably the least flashy/ understated watch in my collection at the moment (excluding Cartiers, PAM and Tudor). 5167 on a rubber is unbeatable for the summer. The only reason that I am considering to let go of 5167 for a 3940 is purely due to the fact that 3940 is half the price of a 5167 which I found incredible. Either 1)5167 is extremely overvalued or/and 2)3940 is extremely undervalued....

Will definitely take a look at those models that you suggested!

[rolexlun]

Originally Posted by AHG

I'm biased but like you I find the modern time-only watches to be too large and "empty" on a small wrist. Also, the 3940 is one of my grails. I had been eyeing it precovid where many great examples were available at a "bargain" price. I didn't pull the trigger and have since regretted it. Finally, I bought a Series 3 3940J this week and I'm waiting for it to be sorted out. It's from a reputable source, but obviously more expensive than a few years back. Also the case has a fair amount of scratches and a few dings, and I've chosen not to have it polished at least for now. A lot of 3940's I've seen online look nice because of too much polishing. I look forward to sharing pictures upon arrival.

Look forward seeing the pics! Have you sent it back to Patek for servicing?

Also, I understand that its quite common for a patina to appear on the PM portion of the sub dial at 9 o'clock (lower half of the 24h indicator). Is this generally regarded as something positive of this watch or something that we should avoid? I personally think a heavy patina may not be very suitable for this watch especially in that area but is interested to know what the experts think here.

[enjoythemusic]

rolexlun, the 3940 is an excellent choice and produced during a glorious time in history for Patek Philippe. Had a 3970er, so I understand. Also had the Aqua (his and hers) back when no one wanted them. Since the Aqua is far overvalued in the secondary market, yes I'd suggest letting it go for a true PP classic 3940 timepeice.

Am sure you probably already have a true sports watch you bang around, as odds are you already have a Rolex and/or Omega, Bvlgari, Tudor, etc.

Look fwd to wrist shots of the 3940.

[rolexpatek363]

Probably a good time to pick up a 3940, especially if you are a formal dresser. Dress watches are very unpopular at the moment as formal dress has become unfashionable, and so the sports models have a lot more traction.

I doubt whether dress watches will ever be anything other than a minority interest in the future.

[edhahn44]

In my opinion the 3940 is the last reference with the real Patek DNA. Such a great watch to own.
Although still very reasonable priced, it’s hard to find great and unpolished examples out there.
Definitely a must have of a watch lover.

Get rid of some of your Cartiers, etc. and try to find one. You should keep the Lange though.


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[AHG]

Originally Posted by rolexlun

Look forward seeing the pics! Have you sent it back to Patek for servicing?

Also, I understand that its quite common for a patina to appear on the PM portion of the sub dial at 9 o'clock (lower half of the 24h indicator). Is this generally regarded as something positive of this watch or something that we should avoid? I personally think a heavy patina may not be very suitable for this watch especially in that area but is interested to know what the experts think here.

That patina on the dial is common as is oxidation of the black hands on the subdials apparently. The watch movement is being serviced by a Patek watchmaker but not at Patek. I’ll probably wear it and see how I feel about the condition before considering sending it to Patek. This will be my first ever vintage or pre-owned watch. So we’ll see how much I’ll appreciate the patina of the case lol. I actually think the dial patina is a nice feature and hard to avoid as well. I’m no expert though.


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