Need help identifying 6150 Explorer

[robsteve]

I am a new member here and figured this is a good place to post a query on my watch. I decided to get out my Dad's old Rolex and put it on for the holidays. After putting it on, I began doing some research on it, with a lot of the Google hits bringing me here.

The is a bit of family history to this watch. It was originally my Grandfather's. He was a commercial diver during WWII and into the 1950's. This may have been what brought him to a Rolex. He died probably in 1953, when my dad was 16 or seventeen. The watch must have been recently purchased and was purchased on payments. My father continued the payments and wore the watch as a daily wearer until his death in car accident in 2001. The watch was recovered at the side of the road at the accident scene, a few days later missing the strap.

I had the watch cleaned and a new strap put on it by the local watch maker which had been servicing it probably since the 1970's. When I picked it up, it had to my surprise , a new Oyster bracelet on it. As far back as I can remember, it always had a Jubilee bracelet on it. The watch maker said that according to the model number or serial number, the Oyster was the appropriate bracelet.

From what I can find on the internet, I think it is probably a dress Explorer, but I am not certain. The case is marked with Brevert 6150 and modele depose 9450**, which dates it as about 1952. This fits the family time line regarding my Grandfather's passing. Just from memory, the dial was refinished probably in the late 1970's. Previous services by Rolex had the dial turn yellow after a few years. The local watch maker sent the dial to somebody in England that specialized in refinishing/cleaning , and it has not yellowed since. I also remember some talk about the movement being put into a new case years ago ( 1950's - 1960's) , but I may have confused it with something else being done such as the face.

I have searched the internet looking for pictures of a watch with a similar dial, but I have not found one. This is the only I have seen with the even Arabic numbers. I am assuming it was a model for the Canadian or North American market. Is this what they call Dress Explorer?

Here are some pictures. When I get some more time, I will try to get some better pictures.

Regards,

Robert

[Lol-x]

Awesome vintage

[Jackxv]

That watch is like being left in a time capsule.

Stunningly beautifull.

Enjoy every beat of the movement and take care of it like you father did.

Wear it in health.

Jack

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by Jackxv

That watch is like being left in a time capsule.

Stunningly beautifull.

Enjoy every beat of the movement and take care of it like you father did.

Wear it in health.

Jack

I have it on now. I have been wearing it since the Christmas season began.

I plan on taking good care of it and will pass it on to one of my sons when I die.

It is really an example of the quality and durability of the Rolex watch. This watch was worn every day by my Dad from 1953 to his death in 2001 and is still in fine shape. Since I have had it, I wear it a few months at a time and then put it away for a while.

I also have a 1988 15010 date that I have worn for the past twenty years. It actually looks worse for the wear than the Explorer. I just put in for a cleaning and service and will wear the Explorer until I get it back.

Robert

[snow_rocks]

the 6150 is a sports watch classic!

[robsteve]

Thanks everybody for the compliments on the watch. I plan on keeping it in the family and passing it on to one of my sons.

Yesterday, I dropped my other Rolex, a 15010 Date, off at the watchmaker to get cleaned and lubed. While I was there, I mentioned that I would like to get the Explorer regulated when I come to pick up the the Date. He suggested I do a daily plot of the 2pm atomic clock time signal to help in the process.

I might also try to get a photo of the movement when he has the back off. Before joining this site, I would never have thought about that :)

Robert

[springer]

Very nice Explorer, very nice.

[kyle L]

Beautiful Vintage, but I can't find an exact example like it. The closest are these:

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by kyle L

Beautiful Vintage, but I can't find an exact example like it.

That is exactly why I posted my query. I haven't had any luck finding any info either. I had came up with the same watches you pictured above. I suspect mine is an iteration of the older Oyster Perpetual with the black strap shown in your post above.

Since it has been in my family since new and has been serviced by Rolex over the years, it must be genuine, I just don't know why it seems to be such a unique dial.

The more I wear it the more I want a similar dial/face on my 15010 Date. The gold numerals on white just looks so good and is easy to read. I just spent the past few hours looking for a modern Arabic dial in white to fit my date and didn't find anything.

Robert

[therolexguy]

Great vintage example and it's nice it's been in the family so long. Hopefully someone here can give you more info on your piece.

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by therolexguy

Great vintage example and it's nice it's been in the family so long. Hopefully someone here can give you more info on your piece.

Your avatar is fitting. My grandfather was a hard hat diver during WWII and into the 1950's. I was told this is why he bought the Rolex, because it was one of the few truly waterproof watches of the time. I don't know if he actually dove with it, but it certainly would have been fine around the water.

Robert

[Nicko]

A beautiful watch. Sorry about your father, that makes the watch even more special. Hold on to it and pass it on to your children. Thanks for sharing your story.

[adam78]

The Dowling and Hess book on Rolex (the "Bible") mentions that the name "Explorer" was used on many different types of watches during the '50s, even on dressier watches, and especially for the Canadian market (I notice you're from Canada), before it settled on the watch we collectors know as "the" Explorer (the ref. 6610 starting in the late '50s, and in particular the 1016 from 1963-89).

The fact that your watch is a ref. 6150 is interesting. This was one of the first Explorers, produced about 1953 with the A296 "bubbleback" type of movement. Most (I thought all) of these were produced with the black Explorer dial (with Arabic 3, 6 and 9 numerals) and as such had Mercedes hands. Yours undoubtably is a "dress" Explorer that used this case ref. but was slightly different. It should have a 20mm interlug width. The original Oyster bracelet would not have had flush endpieces (these came out in 1954).

Wonderful watch and pedigree. Wear it often!

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by adam78

The Dowling and Hess book on Rolex (the "Bible") mentions that the name "Explorer" was used on many different types of watches during the '50s, even on dressier watches, and especially for the Canadian market (I notice you're from Canada), before it settled on the watch we collectors know as "the" Explorer (the ref. 6610 starting in the late '50s, and in particular the 1016 from 1963-89).

The fact that your watch is a ref. 6150 is interesting. This was one of the first Explorers, produced about 1953 with the A296 "bubbleback" type of movement. Most (I thought all) of these were produced with the black Explorer dial (with Arabic 3, 6 and 9 numerals) and as such had Mercedes hands. Yours undoubtably is a "dress" Explorer that used this case ref. but was slightly different. It should have a 20mm interlug width. The original Oyster bracelet would not have had flush endpieces (these came out in 1954).

Wonderful watch and pedigree. Wear it often!

The reference you quote seems to be in 90% of the Google hits I researched.

The dial had been refinished in the 1970's, but it always looked as it did now, just a bit yellowed. I was looking at it closely with a loupe last night and the numbers and the markers ar the odd hours, along with the Rolex logo seem to be gold. The hands ans sweep second had are also at least gold plated. Who ever refinished the dial in England did an excellent job.

Excuse some of the dust and a couple things that look like scratches, they are actually in the crystal, exaggerated by the flash. A 100mm Macro can be brutal up this close too, showing every bit of dust.

[adam78]

I was going to ask if the dial had been refinished, if only because there appeared to be no patina at all. They did do a superb job.

[Playdrv4me]

Thank you for sharing your beautiful watch and the fantastic, albeit at times bittersweet story that accompanies it. The stories that little guy could tell...

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by Playdrv4me

Thank you for sharing your beautiful watch and the fantastic, albeit at times bittersweet story that accompanies it. The stories that little guy could tell...

There is yet another story about another watch in the family. My mother bought me a new Rolex Date 15010, about twenty year ago, which I have worn daily. She died in the accident as well, and this watch I hope to keep in the family as well. I may give it to one of my sons when they turn 25 and then start wearing the Explorer daily.

Robert

[robsteve]

Here is a little better shot from today. We have a winter storm warning and the snow has turned to ice pellets. Figured it would be good light for the Explorer.

The bracelet is not original. I think it originally had a Jubilee bracelet on it. I have my eye on a vintage Jubilee to put on it.

[robsteve]

After doing a bit more research on this forum, I ran across the James Bond thread. As I mentioned in my first post, the movement A296 may have been moved to this case. Is it possible that my Grandfather had a 1953, 6200 Submariner and my father not being a diver had Rolex transfer the movement to an Explorer case?

My Grandfather was a commercial diver during WWII and I was told this is why he bought the Rolex. Being a diver, I suppose he may have originally bought a Submariner. Since it was probably only a year old or less when he died and my father was not a diver is it possible Rolex put it into a more suitable case?

Would the movement have a serial number on it and are there records matching serial numbers of movements to the cases/models they were put into? Secondly is there a serial number range of the early Submariners and or Explorers so that I can see if my serial number fits within either of them.

Regards,

Robert

[robsteve]

Just a bump to see if anybody has any info on this style of Explorer.

The watch is at the Watchmaker's to get a new crystal and to regulate it, as it was running a bit slow. I asked him to record the movement number, and any serial numbers or other info inside the case. I'll post that info when I get it.

Robert

[bb3188]

IMHO, your watch is a dress 6150 explorer.

The serial number suggest the case was from 1953- seem unlikely that Rolex would do a swap on case as the sub came out in 1953 onwards, if a swap was to occur, the serial number of the case would be a later model.

Just seems illogical to buy a new sub in 1953 and request that the case be swapped over to a explorer pretty much straight away, would have been probably been easier to trade in and buy the Explorer.

rgds

Mark

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by bearbrass3188

IMHO, your watch is a dress 6150 explorer.

The serial number suggest the case was from 1953- seem unlikely that Rolex would do a swap on case as the sub came out in 1953 onwards, if a swap was to occur, the serial number of the case would be a later model.

Just seems illogical to buy a new sub in 1953 and request that the case be swapped over to a explorer pretty much straight away, would have been probably been easier to trade in and buy the Explorer.

rgds

Mark

The only thing that made me ask about the swap is I remember there was some mention that it was a new case. My grandfather was a commercial diver at the time he bought it and died around 1954, while the watch was still being paid off. My father would have been about eighteen at the time and finished paying it off . He was not a diver, but just a high school student at the time. Perhaps it wasn't a case swap, but the AD just allowed my Dad to swap the watch for one he preferred?

As for the dress Explorer, I believe it probably is one, but cannot find any photos of similar watches. Actually, I don't think I have seen any photos of 6150 dress Explorers, just other case numbers. Can you point me to any reference material for the Dress explorer?

regards,

Robert

[bb3188]

Hi Robert,

Info on the 6150 is quite rare . I have been researching it for a bit and have not come up with much. If I do come across any info on dress explorer, I will drop you a line.

Good luck with it as they say ....... 'the thrill is in the chase....'

[Tools]

If the caseback is original, look inside and see if there is a date stamp such as II53, or the like for second quarter of 53 etc.,..........

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by Tools

If the caseback is original, look inside and see if there is a date stamp such as II53, or the like for second quarter of 53 etc...........

Can't be a 63, as my grandfather was dead for at least nine years by then. The case also has the 6150 on it and if I understand correctly, the 6150 was made in the 1950's. But, there is a fuzzy memory about it having a new case at some point.

Just picked it up from the watchmaker and he will be emailing me some photos of the interior. I'll try to post them when I get them.

Robert

[robsteve]

I got out the macro and shot a few images of the numbers on the case. I also measured it. The case is about 36mm wide and 44mm lug tip to tug tip. The drilled holes for the spring bars are 1.25mm.

I made the images a bit dark so the numbers are easier to read. The dark spots on the tips of the lugs are just a reflection of the ring light.

I blanked out the last two numbers in the serial number. Each was somewhere between 1 and nine :)





Here is the model number 6150.

[bb3188]

Hi Rob,

Tool has made a good point.

I have an explorer 6150 with a 944XXX serial number. My caseback is 11.53 which suggest the 2nd quarter of 1953. Hence why I thought yours seem more like a 1953 model.

Could you get a pic of the caseback (the watchmaker could do that for you when he/she has opened the case)

best of luck !

Mark

[robsteve]

Originally Posted by bearbrass3188

Hi Rob,

Could you get a pic of the caseback (the watchmaker could do that for you when he/she has opened the case)

best of luck !

Mark

The watchmaker had it this week for regulating and I asked him to take some pictures. They are going to email the pictures to me in the next day or so.

The only problem with the 1960's theory is that my Grandfather, who bought the watch, died in 1954.

Robert

[Changmaisausage]

Robert I'm now waiting in aticipation pictures pictures

Great sad story keep the watches as part of your family and history.

Dave

[robsteve]

I just got the picture from the watchmaker. It is not very good. It was taken at their second location and did not include the case back. I just talked to the staff at the store front location and he offered to bring in his own camera and get some good photos. I might just have them open the case and take the photos myself.

All you can tell from the photo is that it is an A296 movement, which verifies it is a 1950's 6150.



Robert