What makes a AP ROC so expensive???

[patrike]

I've always loved the design of both the 39mm and 41mm ROC. I think they're amazing looking watches.

This is not in any way me trying to bash the watch. It's more of a try to justify a purchase.

Here in Sweden it's about $ 25k. So what do I pay for? 25k, that's a fairly large amount of money.

I know it can't be the movement. Because its a F.Piguet (Swatch). I know its a good movement. But its also used in omegas that cost 1/5 of the AP (from what i know) Sure it's a very nicely finished watch. But 25K?

If the ROC had one of those amazing AP movements with a display to look at it through, together with that fantastic bracelet and case finish I would understand the price.

So what do I pay for. Just finish and a AP logo?


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk

[Tony-GB]

Basically, yes. But then, aren't all watches massively overpriced? You're trying to apply logic to an illogical passion. If we weren't deluded about our watches, we'd all be wearing £10 Casio's.

[T.S.Eliot]

I own the 39 ROC and never gave a thought about the movement, it is a nicely finished timepiece and well balanced too. Never liked the 41 though

[benlee]

Originally Posted by patrike

So what do I pay for. Just finish and a AP logo?

Well, yes. And the AP brand's prestige, history and all that comes with it. But if it's me, I will wait for the next gen ROC that AP will use it's own movement and a display back.

[patrike]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

Basically, yes. But then, aren't all watches massively overpriced? You're trying to apply logic to an illogical passion. If we weren't deluded about our watches, we'd all be wearing £10 Casio's.

Perhaps they are. But when comparing the ROC with a Daytona for example. A Daytona seems so much more reasonable priced. There's been some effort put in to the movement, robust case, keeps great value, low service cost etc.

BUT not that amazing design.

I guess I'm still waiting for the perfect watch! :)


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk

[patrike]

Originally Posted by benlee

Well, yes. And the AP brand, history and all that comes with it. But if it's me, I will wait for the next gen ROC that AP will use it's own movement and a display back.

Yes. I thought of that also. But with a new AP inhouse mvmnt I guess they will raise the price 30% also.


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk

[marathonmatt]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

Basically, yes. But then, aren't all watches massively overpriced? You're trying to apply logic to an illogical passion. If we weren't deluded about our watches, we'd all be wearing £10 Casio's.

Probably THE most accurate statement I have ever read on any forum. Well said, sir. Hmmm... What to get next? :)

[jojosnr]

so please be selective. not everything ap is great, I think. for that matter, not everything any other brand is great.

[texex91]

Over priced in comparison to what? AP makes around 30,000 (give or take) watches per year. Rolex makes around 1 million. Is Rolex overpriced--probably. It's supply and demand. As long as people are willing to pay the market value for Patek, AP, Rolex, and the list goes on will, they all will continue to sell watches at whatever they wish.

I've never understood these threads of why is brand X so expensive vs brand y. AP is one of only two Swiss watch houses that are still family owned (Patek is the other). You my friend will have to pay to play if you want an AP--it's that simple. If you don't want to spend $25K (in the US you can get a brand new 15400 for about $12K--sorry they are so expensive where you live), then please do get an Omega/Swatch as you stated. If you want a Daytona (good watch BTW), there a million of them out there, so you should be able to get a good price.

If you want an AP, then be ready to pay the price of admission. However, like most things in life you get what you pay for...

And one last reason...here you go (albeit, it's no Daytona or Omega).

[bayerische]

Patrik, här är orsaken till priset: (Here's the reason to it's price)

[VICI]

The finishing, elegance, exclusivity.

You can and most likely will be surrounded by Rolex wearers - not AP's.

Why buy a Rolls when a Volkswagen has 4 wheels as well?

Answer: because I want a Rolls!

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1373808938.253929.jpg

[FNFZ4]

Originally Posted by Tony-GB

Basically, yes. But then, aren't all watches massively overpriced? You're trying to apply logic to an illogical passion. If we weren't deluded about our watches, we'd all be wearing £10 Casio's.

why buy a $10casio when my Cell Phone does a better job?

[Manofsteelpt]

Originally Posted by bayerische

Patrik, här är orsaken till priset: (Here's the reason to it's price)

LOVE this WG ROC!!!

Originally Posted by Alex_NYC

Why buy a Rolls when a Volkswagen has 4 wheels as well?

Answer: because I want a Rolls!

Excellent analogy Alex

[orangedial]

You need to own one to fully understand what you are paying for... Maybe by then the movement, AP logo and finish would no longer be important anymore. And you probably wouldn't even lay eyes on that ever popular and cheaper-to-maintain Daytonas again!

Well, at least for me

[patrike]

So. my conclusion is that a large part of the price (regarding the roc) consist of "soft values". History of the brand, family owned etc.

Is it the same with entry level Pateks?


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk

[texex91]

Originally Posted by patrike

So. my conclusion is that a large part of the price (regarding the roc) consist of "soft values". History of the brand, family owned etc.

Is it the same with entry level Pateks?


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk

Oh boy, here we go...popcorn anyone.

[QueueCumber]

I always end up in trouble when I respond to these kinds of threads... LOL!

[QueueCumber]

To be fair texex91 and Alex_NYC, he is talking about the ROCs and not the ROOs. The ROOs only outsource the chronograph module and not the base unit.

He is talking about these pieces, which are modified outsourced movements:

[texex91]

Originally Posted by QueueCumber

To be fair texex91 and Alex_NYC, he is talking about the ROCs and not the ROOs. The ROOs only outsource the chronograph module and not the base unit.

He is talking about these pieces, which are modified outsourced movements:

Yes I know the difference

I really was trying make a point on pricing. ROC rocks in my book any day of the week

[VICI]

Originally Posted by QueueCumber

To be fair texex91 and Alex_NYC, he is talking about the ROCs and not the ROOs. The ROOs only outsource the chronograph module and not the base unit.

The argument could be made that they are not COSC so why spend the cash either on the ROC or ROO.

It's all worth what the next person is willing to pay.

[ufboy73]

the question seems to strike some sort of nerve - i really dont understand why.

is it so wrong to ask what goes into an AP that drives perceived value?

some responses seem almost defensive - no kidding its what someone is willing to pay...the question could be interpreted as why are people willing to pay more for an AP?

[patrike]

I don't want to upset anyone.

It's just me trying to justify a purchase in the future. My heart says BUY, because of the amazing design, exclusivity, brand history etc. But my brain ( economic sense) says NO because of the pretty low second hand value, no in house movement, easy to scratch, expensive to service.

I could go for a 15300/15400 with inhouse, good value etc. But I really like the look of the ROC.

[cdnyc]

Originally Posted by patrike

So. my conclusion is that a large part of the price (regarding the roc) consist of "soft values". History of the brand, family owned etc.

Apparently, AP modifies and decorates the FP 1185 movement in ways that certainly make it more "valuable" (gold rotor, etc.). But don't know how much this actually improves the performance of the movement, and since there's no exhibition caseback, all that decorating is a little moot. But at least it partially explains this being a more expensive FP 1185 movement -- as oppose to AP just arbitrarily marking it up.

However, I would say basis of the ROC's superiority and premium over the Daytona is a "hard value" attribute. It's putting the Daytona on one wrist and the watch pictured below on the other wrist. I spent several years wanting a Daytona. Then one random day I put a ROC on and realized without question that it was worth waiting and saving some extra cash to look down as see that unbeatable dial/bezel/case combo and feel the hug of the greatest bracelet in history. Secondarily, I was very happy that -- although the watch is recognizable and well-established -- I would rarely (if ever) see someone else wearing it!

[Tony-GB]

Originally Posted by bayerische

Patrik, här är orsaken till priset: (Here's the reason to it's price)

You're cheating! That's WG!!! Better than steel!!!!

(To the uninitiated: It has square markers on the dial.)

[patrike]

Originally Posted by orangedial

You need to own one to fully understand what you are paying for... Maybe by then the movement, AP logo and finish would no longer be important anymore. And you probably wouldn't even lay eyes on that ever popular and cheaper-to-maintain Daytonas again!

Well, at least for me

That's one of the most AMAZING AP ROC pics EVER! That's pic make me want to buy one instantly.

You always have great pics btw! :)

[s14roller]

Trying to make logical justification for an emotional purchase?

[patrike]

Originally Posted by s14roller

Trying to make logical justification for an emotional purchase?

Yes. Guess its impossible. :)

[Coolcamden]

Totally dig the swirls and dings and scratches on this watch.

That's real life. Scars of a "well-loved" watch.

Mine picks up scratches out of thin air, I swear.

Originally Posted by bayerische

Patrik, här är orsaken till priset: (Here's the reason to it's price)

[wrxsti]

try a daytona and roc on either wrist at the same ad, get the one that smiles back at u. I will tell u that Ap's finishing, bracelet, bevels, chamfers, brushed and polished surfaces are truly unbelievable.

Like others have said, you have to pay to play. If you always bought omegas and never tried other brands you will be happy. Then u try rolex and fall in love and you will be happy too. Then u try an Ap and realize oh I have been missing out on all this!

[cdnyc]

Originally Posted by s14roller

Trying to make logical justification for an emotional purchase?

Where's the lack of logic in ascribing value to aesthetically superior attributes (aesthetically superior in my opinion, realizing that's subjective)? To me the most important thing about a watch is its looks. Were not taking about two watches that look particularly similar here.

Patricke, I hear you on the 15400 point (I.e., that it has in house movement and exhibition case back). Given my preferences, the dial of the ROC offsets these factors.