Check this Radial out

[twnturbo]

Everyone loves a good radial gmt story & this one looks pretty cool

https://www.windvintage.com/rolex-gm...lopez-portillo

[velogeek]

Cam showed me this watch and the photo's yesterday. It's a great story and beautiful watch.

[TimeLord2]

The hands... Not what I would call in "flawless" condition.

[Dan S]

Maybe I'm just out of touch and it's certainly an interesting watch, but I can't help but feel a growing disconnect between the increasingly unrealistic price expectations of high-end dealers and the current state of global affairs. I guess they think that people with more money than sense are immune to market forces.

[phillip ridley]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Maybe I'm just out of touch and it's certainly an interesting watch, but I can't help but feel a growing disconnect between the increasingly unrealistic price expectations of high-end dealers and the current state of global affairs. I guess they think that people with more money than sense are immune to market forces.

I thought the same

[interestedwatcher]

Whats with the hands, looks like water damage?

[Juhuatai]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Maybe I'm just out of touch and it's certainly an interesting watch, but I can't help but feel a growing disconnect between the increasingly unrealistic price expectations of high-end dealers and the current state of global affairs. I guess they think that people with more money than sense are immune to market forces.

Think it will sit for a while. IMO, there seems to be an increasing trend to try to puff up the provenance. The first president of mexico, while interesting, is not exactly the most compelling person to have worn a Rolex watch. Sure it's nice that he had it but in the grand scheme of things, it's not exactly Che's watch or Fidel Castro's right?

[Juhuatai]

Also:

"A GMT-Master with “Mark 3” radial dial in this crisp, unpolished condition is worth about $40,000 in our opinion"

Is this true. I had no idea a matte 1675 even radial unpolished would fetch this much...market has really gone off the rocker.

[springer]

Originally Posted by Juhuatai

Also:

"A GMT-Master with “Mark 3” radial dial in this crisp, unpolished condition is worth about $40,000 in our opinion"

Is this true. I had no idea a matte 1675 even radial unpolished would fetch this much...market has really gone off the rocker.

------------------------------------------------------------

I think your expectations are very high for the value of these radial models.

For those that haven't read the info in the provided link, what we have is a vintage, radial dial GMT that was given to the President of Mexico by none other than Fidel Castro - a notorious communist dictator.

What I find interesting is I see nothing after reading this article that indicates where the watch was purchased or why there aren't any accompanying accessories documenting the purchase of this watch - a watch which was more than likely purchased south of the American border but wears an original USA bracelet. The article goes on to provide several photos of the watch itself and the president wearing the GMT. The caseback was engraved at some point, and from reading the article, it seems to have been engraved back when the president was practicing law - before he became president.

The read is interesting and this GMT is definitely a "watch with a story."

[1665fan]

Originally Posted by Juhuatai

Also:

"A GMT-Master with “Mark 3” radial dial in this crisp, unpolished condition is worth about $40,000 in our opinion"

Is this true. I had no idea a matte 1675 even radial unpolished would fetch this much...market has really gone off the rocker.

No that’s is not true at all....dealer hype

[1watch]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Maybe I'm just out of touch and it's certainly an interesting watch, but I can't help but feel a growing disconnect between the increasingly unrealistic price expectations of high-end dealers and the current state of global affairs. I guess they think that people with more money than sense are immune to market forces.

It is an interesting story, given the people and places that watch has been around of historical significance. I understand the unease of reconciling a discretionary purchase in the state of our current environment and hope we see a return to normalcy in the not too distant future. That said, I’m not sure it would impact the offering of collector watches and those with interesting stories to the market, especially models that are highly desired in top condition. Maybe they will have a temporarily tighter circle of parties interested or not move if perceived value to price isn’t just right?


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[Tom1675]

Originally Posted by springer

------------------------------------------------------------

I think your expectations are very high for the value of these radial models.

For those that haven't read the info in the provided link, what we have is a vintage, radial dial GMT that was given to the President of Mexico by none other than Fidel Castro - a notorious communist dictator.

What I find interesting is I see nothing after reading this article that indicates where the watch was purchased or why there aren't any accompanying accessories documenting the purchase of this watch - a watch which was more than likely purchased south of the American border but wears an original USA bracelet. The article goes on to provide several photos of the watch itself and the president wearing the GMT. The caseback was engraved at some point, and from reading the article, it seems to have been engraved back when the president was practicing law - before he became president.

The read is interesting and this GMT is definitely a "watch with a story."

Great catch here.

The article also makes reference to the President's Sea Dweller which is a collection of service parts. It sold for quite a sum in April of 2008, arguably one of the worst times to be investing in just about anything.

https://catalog.antiquorum.swiss/en/...pez%20portillo

I think the sellers' offer this link as part of their justification for the estimate on this radial.

[miamiclay]

THIS ARTICLE says they got it from Portillo’s family.

Orchi seems to have some doubts, there’s some talk about it on IG

[Wahlberg]

Originally Posted by miamiclay

THIS ARTICLE says they got it from Portillo’s family.

Orchi seems to have some doubts, there’s some talk about it on IG

Could you link to his instagram please?

[miamiclay]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

Could you link to his instagram please?

On IG -

Eric Wind is @ericmwind
Cameron/Craft + Tailored is @craftandtailored
Orchi is @orchi_palar

[Swearengen]

Buddy Orchi

Originally Posted by miamiclay

On IG -

Eric Wind is @ericmwind
Cameron/Craft + Tailored is @craftandtailored
Orchi is @orchi_palar

[214270Explorer]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Maybe I'm just out of touch and it's certainly an interesting watch, but I can't help but feel a growing disconnect between the increasingly unrealistic price expectations of high-end dealers and the current state of global affairs. I guess they think that people with more money than sense are immune to market forces.

Exactly

[1watch]

Originally Posted by miamiclay

THIS ARTICLE says they got it from Portillo’s family.



Orchi seems to have some doubts, there’s some talk about it on IG

This whole topic was addressed on a different forum by the sellers. This Orchi character hasn’t provided any proof to substantiate his vitriolic claims based on pixilated pics that in no way can support his claims. It seems he and his followers have an agenda that’s not based on principles of a healthy and respectful discussion in the community.


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[swish77]

Originally Posted by 1watch

This whole topic was addressed on a different forum by the sellers. This Orchi character hasn’t provided any proof to substantiate his vitriolic claims based on pixilated pics that in no way can support his claims. It seems he and his followers have an agenda that’s not based on principles of a healthy and respectful discussion in the community.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not sure about the motivation, but the blurry old black & white photo Orchi uses as "proof" the original dial is different than the current dial is not even close to being conclusive. I can barely tell it's a GMT in the photo, let alone what kind of dial's in the watch.

[phillip ridley]

Putting everything aside, this is a neat piece in which there were not too many made. Plus, it did belong to José López Portillo. That itself is pretty cool.

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by swish77

Not sure about the motivation, but the blurry old black & white photo Orchi uses as "proof" the original dial is different than the current dial is not even close to being conclusive. I can barely tell it's a GMT in the photo, let alone what kind of dial's in the watch.

The photos are really blurry, but if they show anything, they show that the lume plots are pretty far from the edge, like the current Mk 3 dial.

[1watch]

I think it’s an interesting story and older pics are inconclusive to determine the dial is anything other than represented by the sellers.


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[Wahlberg]

The watch is on hold, so sale pending.

[offrdmania]

Originally Posted by Wahlberg

The watch is on hold, so sale pending.

A sucker is born everyday

[Alex The Watch Guy]

Just speaks to the state of the market, you can pretty much put anything out there and someone will buy it. Even with supposed ties to a 5th tier political figure ;-)

[springer]

Originally Posted by 1watch

I think it’s an interesting story and older pics are inconclusive to determine the dial is anything other than represented by the sellers.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What do you finding interesting...that it is true story or it is BS story regardless of whether the dial is original or not?

[Dan S]

Buyers often say "it's a keeper", but the reality is that every watch gets sold someday. Sooner or later the buyer will understand what's obvious to most of us, which is that undocumented provenance doesn't add much value, and the watch will have to stand on its own merits.

[1watch]

Originally Posted by springer

What do you finding interesting...that it is true story or it is BS story regardless of whether the dial is original or not?

I haven’t seen objective proof to state it’s not from Portilló and am also aware there is controversy around the family acquisition....makes the story interesting and I’m not a buyer regardless of the current details.


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[1watch]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Buyers often say "it's a keeper", but the reality is that every watch gets sold someday. Sooner or later the buyer will understand what's obvious to most of us, which is that undocumented provenance doesn't add much value, and the watch will have to stand on its own merits.

I agree it has to stand on it’s own merits. Whoever buys it will need to be comfortable with that aspect.


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[springer]

Originally Posted by 1watch

I haven’t seen objective proof to state it’s not from Portilló and am also aware there is controversy around the family acquisition....makes the story interesting and I’m not a buyer regardless of the current details.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I haven't seen any proof at all that the watch was a gift from Castro which would significantly affect the value I would think.